Garrosh vs Varian

[Aleu]

Yay possible Lore debate. I think most players can agree... These two are kind of jerks, but who's the bigger jerk?

For I saw Garrosh. He was a little emo boy in Nagrand and now's he all 'RAWRLOOKATMEI'MJUSTLIKEDADDY!'. Varian's dislike is more justified then Garrosh's is. He's just hot headed and I want Thrall or Saurfang to slap him. >C

[Sonata]

Good thing you didn't make me choose between Varian and Thrall would have been a tie.

I'm evil and going to put Garrosh onto the hotseat, not because I don't like, but because...he's begging for it. Saurfang should do something, Thrall is kindaa having problems on keeping the nerdraged emokid in bars. (Thought I still admire Garrosh's in a twisted sorta way)

Varian, he's got a justified cause that is blind to oblivous. Aka. he's being human...I personaly like how Varian is potrayed in the comics more than his ingame personality.....atleast that one seems nice and cool, but maybe the good king lost it after Bolvar kicked the bucket.

[Karathyriel]

I have a different point of view.
Garrosh Hellscream is an orc. Now that he knows of his heritage, he just tries to live up to his name. The problem is, they allowed him to play with the big boys but he has no experience whatsoever in leading. If you take that into account, he's doing a rather good job in northrend. Maybe he's a hothead but that might be in the blood (Grom Hellscream was no war hero for nothing) or again being inexperienced.

King Varian is a grown man and used to wear the crown. He suffered and now tries to pay back. He doesn't care that it wasn't Thrall or the new horde that had him suffer and he is willing to go to war and sacrifice his own people for his personal thirst for revenge.

That makes Varian Wrynn the bigger jerk in my opinion.

Sidenote: But I really must say "Thank you!" to that stupid bastard on the stormwind throne. I just hated all that cuddling with the alliance. Yeah, we needed to help each other against the legion or the scourge but, like they say: "The enemy of my enemy is my friend - as long as there is a shared enemy!" I just like to feather humans backs with arrows, kick gnomes from high mountains and I will never ever miss any chance of cutting one of those bastards throats, who call themselves Kal'dorei.

We are living in a world of warcraft and we should try to fit in! *testing the loading mechanism of his gun and the edge of his spears tip* Let them come and they'll see that we are ready to fight...

...FOR THE HORDE!

[Nightmare452]

/cheer@Karathyriel
Especially about punting gnomes. =3

[Aleu]

Karathyriel - You do make an interesting point, but regardless I think he's just lacking discipline. He was found to be the son of Hellscream and put in charge right away. My issues still remain that he is hot headed and he doesn't think before he acts, thus why I think he needs to be humiliated. By the Alliance or Thrall, it doesn't matter.

You are right about Varian though. If he was indeed a real king, he'd let go of his hatred of sake of his people. However, he doesn't. I still say Garrosh is the bigger jerk.

Also, yes. I believe Tauren should have a 'Gnome Punt' ability. /sagenod

[Saturo]

I believe Tauren should have a 'Gnome Punt' ability.

[Gnome Punt]
You go into a rage, causing you to punt the closest Gnome.
Look at him go!

[Sphax]

i voted garosh.

simply b ecause he kills my favourite cow Cairne Bloodhoof

rip my dear friend

[Karathyriel]

simply because he kills my favourite cow Cairne Bloodhoof

That is still only a rumor, just like Thrall becoming the next Warden (or Guard?) of Tirisfal.

We will see what happens when Cata hits the shelves, not one minute earlier, I guess.

[Aleu]

i voted garosh.

simply b ecause he kills my favourite cow Cairne Bloodhoof

rip my dear friend

I don't think he will. Chances are Cairne will die, but die of old age. Thus why Baine becomes the Taurens next leader, but I don't think the Tauren would stand for that. Thrall wouldn't either.

Also, I think it was denied that Thrall was going to be a Guardian. He was asked, but declined. He may be leaving Garrosh in charge of Org, but Garrosh will not be the Warchief. I think Thrall is going into the Maelstrom to lead the main assult.

This is what I've heard anyways.

[Dragonpuff]

I picked Garrosh, simply because I really don't like his character development. IMO, Blizzard totally dropped the ball with him. When I first saw him in Nagrad, I wanted to slap him because he was being such an emo Orc. Granted, he was depressed about his dad, but moping about with everyone else around you is still fighting a war? /slap!
Then, turning point! He learned what really happened with Grom, and had the chance to become a better character!
But no...
No, he had to appear in Azeroth, all a rage'n, all gung-ho about killing shit. Don't matter what the shit was, it had to be dead. -_-'' I wanted to slap him all over again.
A well developed character doesn't go from depressed to hulk-rage right after learning their father, whom they were depressed about in the first place, had saved his people by overcoming a similar hulk-rage. He may be trying to emulate the success of his father, but if he had any brains in his head, he'd see he was making all the same mistakes his dad did.
Personally, the whole idea that Garrosh is acting the way he is because of his bloodline is... Bubkiss! Badass father does not equal badass son. Attitudes like that aren't passed through blood. Orcs as a people are fighters, yes, but being a dick is an individual choice.

Varian is a pretty big dick too though. Sure, his character actually has plausible reasoning as to why he is how he is, but I think he's taking it a bit too far. I like Comic him so much more. ^-^

[Karathyriel]

I believe Tauren should have a 'Gnome Punt' ability.

Sorry Mania, but I couldn't resist...
If the file is to big, just delete it without further notice!

[Saturo]

Isn't this the wrong thread for Gnome punting?

[VelkynKarma]

I gotta agree with Karathyriel; I voted Varian is the bigger jerk.

Garosh is also quite a jerk, but I find it's largely out of inexperience. He does need to be smacked, but at the same time he's acting his age, relatively.

While I can understand Varian's dislike of the orcs to some degree--slavery and gladiator matches will do that to a person--he still acts completely irresponsibly. When I'm wandering around the Argent Tournament and Varian shows up and starts bitching at Tirian about how orcs are honorless and can't be trusted, I just want to kick him. Orcs are among the most HONORABLE of the Horde races; when it comes to backstabbing I'd honestly watch the undead and even the blood elves first. Both races have suffered at Arthas' hands and have proven they are willing to do extremely nasty things to get their way.

I notice that Thrall also went through a lot of crap, but Thrall is still able to say, "Hey guys...we really can't be fighting each other right now. There's kinda this lich king guy who's hovering over us and totally wants to eradicate everything that is even slightly living. Let's deal with him first m'kay?" Varian, on the other hand, is dumb enough to refuse to listen to Thrall's wisdom, lead an attack on the Undercity--which could have incited a 2-front war on his part, that's moronic on a purely military level--and STILL claim that his acts were justified. He's damn lucky Jaina saved his a** by teleporting them out of UC before he made a big mess.

On a purely personal level, I hate Varian because he is a bad, bad tank. When I did my undercity attack quest on my NE hunter (only 73 at the time), I kept getting attacked by everything that moved even if it had been attacking Varian first. I should not be able to pull aggro off of a raid boss with a poorly-geared level 73 BM hunter who is not even using her pet By contrast, my heroics-geared rogue went all out and blew all his cooldowns on any number of demons in the horde version of the quest, and Thrall never once lost aggro. In short: Thrall cares, Varian cares about himself.

~VelkynKarma

[Kalliope]

I abstain.

They're both meatheads.

[Dvorkin]

King Varian is a grown man and used to wear the crown. He suffered and now tries to pay back. He doesn't care that it wasn't Thrall or the new horde that had him suffer and he is willing to go to war and sacrifice his own people for his personal thirst for revenge.

He does not care? No, he just does not see any difference between "old horde" and "new horde". And, as a matter of fact, neither do I - the capital of "new horde" still named after the leader of "old horde", Horde forces in Northrend still backstab Alliance at the every opportunity (Vengeance Landing, Broken Front etc). Undead are still evil (no, Putress was not along - I do have a high level Horde toon and I do read all quests text), orcs are still bloodthirsty as ever, nothing changed at all.

Yes, Varian is willing to go to war - because this is the only language you "green-skinned aberrations" understand . He's not a jerk at all, and he has my full support...

...FOR THE ALLIANCE!

-Dvorkin.

[Karathyriel]

...FOR THE ALLIANCE!

-Dvorkin.

I gotta go now or I'll be late for work. But I get back to this when I'm back home...
Mean, old dirty traitor bastard!

[Dulanie]

I'd say Varian is a justified jerk, and Garrosh an immature jerk, so it's really a matter of perspective. My vote though goes to Varian. Blizz should have had his mutilated half digested corpse drop from the neck of Ony's head in my opinion.

[Sonata]

I don't what to say, yes I wholeheartetly agree.
But....Gnome putting action for Taurens has my vote! Let's tell Blizz to make it happen...For the GIF Karathyriel, I bow before you.

Moving on.
But yeah Varian is not acting like a king and acting more of a highclass jerk, Garrosh is a hotheaded jerk. Both in the end need a bang of reality on the head.
Their personas are actualy interesting in a way that how will they act in the coming up games. Garrosh hasn't had that much action after the Crusade coliseum.
Varian actualy has a development in the Icecrown citadel raid. He as a father understood and stopped Muradin Bronzebeard from forcing Saurfang away, letting him collect his sons body and walking away in peace.
He also states that he holds respect to Saurfang's son as a hero who deserves a hero's burial.

Now actualy I want to see what Garrosh does next. The only thing he's done so far is test Thrall patience and humiliate him even before the mages of Dalaran and infront of Jaina who is his dear friend.
The killing of Cairne is something so absurd, Thrall wouldn't let it happen if he knew. I bet he's would still be trying to find out who Abasic Campfire is!

But Varian and Garrosh do not belong in the same space, as seen in the Ulduar trailer, jerks do not go well together. But I think both are quite lovable jerks in a twisted way.
And from what I know Garrosh belittles the Alliance as Varian does the Horde IN THE Crusader!

EDIT:
Fixed Karathyriel's name...but I like calling you Kat for some odd reason!!

[Kalasha]

The old "douche and a turd sandwich" canundrum....

Varian is a piece of crap because he's supposed to be the king of the humans, yet throws human lives away just so he can feel better about himself

Garrosh... ugh. I'm an Allliance player, but if that loudmouth piece of crap kills Cairne I swear to the Earth Mother, I'll kill him.

I love that shaggy old man-cow.

[VelkynKarma]

Varian actualy has a development in the Icecrown citadel raid. He as a father understood and stopped Muradin Bronzebeard from forcing Saurfang away, letting him collect his sons body and walking away in peace.
He also states that he holds respect to Saurfang's son as a hero who deserves a hero's burial.

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten about that. He was redeemed slightly (veeery slightly) in my eyes over that. To be honest, it seems like development, but it also seems a little out of character for him. He loathes orcs. Showing kindness to one? Weird.

~VelkynKarma