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Should Blizz lock a hunter pet tame behind raiding/pvp?
Yes 23%  23%  [ 11 ]
No 77%  77%  [ 37 ]
Total votes : 48
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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 7:50 am 
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After Lalathin was found in the Nighthold instance, it made me wonder if Blizzard is toying with the idea of hunter pets being locked behind raiding or even PVP content. Granted Lalathin looks like it doesn't require raiding, just the borrowing of a lockout. However it made me wonder.

So would you guys be for a pet being locked behind raiding or PVP? What I mean by that is a pet that is only accessible by those who actively and consistently raid/pvp current content (this isn't counting old xpac bosses becoming tameable later). Perhaps you have to kill a certain boss X times to access the pet. Regardless of the "how" they do it, do you like the idea?

For raiding, do you think it should be accessible to LFR and higher, normal, heroic, mythic? PvP could be casual BG, RBG, arena?

My personal opinion is absolutely not. I can see the appeal of having a special tameable pet adorned with blades and skulls available to dedicated PVPers, but I think its a slippery slope. Lalathin is acceptable to me since it is looking like we can just use someones lockout, but I'm not a fan of hunter pets being locked this way. Mounts, battle pets, transmog, recipes, they can have all that. I say keep hunter pets out of it.

What say you? Love to hear the community's thoughts on it since our little group loves our pets (so much so we sometimes squabble like cats and dogs :lol:)


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:02 am 
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Voted "No", however, my opinion is a bit more torn than that.

I love it when Blizzard implements special pets / challenge tames, like Gara or a fel-bound wolf from Draenor or tracking challenges. Fenryr is already a bit of a stretch since he is more of a gear check than an actual challenge. Locking special tames behind instanced content turns a personal hunter challenge into a team effort. While not necessarily a bad thing in a massively multiplayer game, judging by the WoW forums people hate forced socialisation (the complaints about Class Order Hall campaign/professions requiring dungeons are still appearing now and then). I know I do. Yes, one can say "It is not forced, you can deal without that one pet, it's not like it locks you out of the end game", but that's not how people feel.

Locking something behind PvP is its own special can of worms. I, personally, love PvP. Or, at least, I loved it before Legion. Would I like to see Kor'kron wolves or Sentinel sabers as pets? Hell, yes. But I also know that vast majority of players does not like PvP, and passionately hates to deal with it (example: Dalaran's underbelly). Were Blizzard to bring arena or RBGs or, especially, rating into this, it would result in a mess.

TL;DR: Locking tames behind something is fine, as long as that "something" can be approached by people individually and on their terms (solo challenge, item, reputation, tracking, trick tame, etc.)


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:10 am 
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Shelassa wrote:
TL;DR: Locking tames behind something is fine, as long as that "something" can be approached by people individually and on their terms (solo challenge, item, reputation, tracking, trick tame, etc.)


I agree with this statement and pretty much for this reason alone, I am also casting my vote for "No".


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:19 am 
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Niabi wrote:
Shelassa wrote:
TL;DR: Locking tames behind something is fine, as long as that "something" can be approached by people individually and on their terms (solo challenge, item, reputation, tracking, trick tame, etc.)


I agree with this statement and pretty much for this reason alone, I am also casting my vote for "No".


Seconded. Same reason, same vote.

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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:39 am 
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Something like Lalathin is only "locked" behind raiding for the current expansion- just like every raid boss tame. It's not like she's going to require a raid group to get forever, and neither would any pet located in or associated with a raid instance.

As long as it becomes available to anyone solo with time, I have no issues with pets set up like this.


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:50 am 
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I'm fine with it being locked behind raiding, but not pvp. For raiding, you can eventual get to them via skill or overpowering the content. For pvping, things will continue to scale up due to your level. Further, you have other players to deal with - players that can and will grief you and the pet you're trying to tame.


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:57 am 
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The whole "solo" aspect of it is what tips me over too. Hunter tames feel like it should be something the hunter does. Sure we saw some help from druids with Hutia and I believe we had help with interrupts with Skarr, but so far pets are obtained solo when released. And while every raid so far is soloable with time (aside from a few wonky bosses that usually get changed), I prefer the idea of pets being solo obtainable at content. While some may require more play time than others to obtain (like Feathermanes), they will still be solo obtainable in the patch cycle it was released.


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:31 pm 
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Newp. It's a solo activity. Unless you ask your raid super nicely, it's gonna be tough. For some folks, taming, pet collecting, etc IS the game instead of raiding.

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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:49 pm 
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If it's added to old content raid, It's cool, like the way to get mechanical scorpids.
I'm not really happy with tames being in current raids. But that's just me.

And no, never behind pvp imo

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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:11 pm 
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I voted no. I do not like the idea of having, for example, a pet locked behind a raid boss that only one hunter can tame. Add in a high difficulty and it becomes frustrating. It would become something you would potentiality have to spend dkp or whatever point currency you use on if there is competition.

I'm fine with a pet coincidentally being in a raid, as long as it's LFR+ (you can hang out after raid ends to do it) and doesn't require more than yourself to get to it. For example, a tracking challenge that at most would require invisibility pots, or depending on the species, want you to spec surv for camouflage.

Same with pvp. Don't gate pets behind prestige or titles. You could make it a challenge inside a battleground. A tracking tame or boso you'd have to kite to 50% (to make sure whoever gets aggro keeps aggro) before they can tame.... course in that case there is always the chance of griefing but Blizz had shown they don't care much about that.

TLDR: keep it individualized. Add them in if you must. But don't gate them behind titles, prestige or difficulty. And don't make it so you need another person's, or raids, assistance.


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:25 pm 
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I'm fine with raid content, but NOT pvp.

Chromaggus, Chimaeron, and Fenryr (not raid, but close enough considering difficulty) are good examples of PvE content tames. One you tame right away, one you have to not kill it by accident, and the other requires you to use your knowledge of playing Beast Mastery to reach. Fenryr is the perfect example of a challenge tame in that regard, while Chromaggus is a pretty weak one. Chimaeron is an okay example in that the challenge comes from us being too strong, and having to hold back. The mechanical scorpions are also good examples, because you need to collect items to literally craft it. That was pretty genius, as well as fun. It was a good reason to go back to that god awful raid, especially since I got my scorpion mount while farming for scorpion parts. More stuff like Fenryr and the Mechanical Scorpions would be great, especially if we got a glitch in every dungeon/raid instance where we could tame it without needing the challenge like Fenryr had for a short time (My hunter has terrible luck in raids, let alone getting into a pug run). The best thing about raid and dungeon tames is that you can do it at any time without spawn timer worries (Excluding Lalathin) and idiotic party members.

I hate PvP with a passion, and would be absolutely cross if I had to do it to find a pet that I would want. Gon broke my interest in collecting every Spirit Beast, since it required me (Alliance) to go to a Horde capital in HOPES that I could snag it. All it takes is one jerk to ruin the fun, and I hate that possibility. I do not want to rely on pure luck to tame things, since that isn't fun at all and reminds me of the absolute worst Hunter I ever came across who tried to steal and subsequently killed Terrorpene when I was already taming it during Cataclysm (I still remember their name, the absolute trash heap). That was almost pvp since it was a Horde player, and that was already bad enough since I didn't have the patience to get on an alt and send them a thesis on how their life is pathetic for having to steal in a video game. I do NOT want a repeat of this trash behavior, and I especially do not want to be forced to rely on random people who have no reason to even care to be friendly.

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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:00 pm 
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Well the thread isn't even open a full day and the response is overwhelmingly one sided. I 100% appreciate them thinking outside the box on pets, but I hope they never go this route. (the same with Gon/Spectral Gryphon as well, hope they never revisit that idea).


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:21 pm 
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Yeah, I'm gonna throw clickable objects that spawn a pet in a freaking capital city as another terrible idea. Too much potential for grief*.


*You can't stop ALL grief, but geez louise.

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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 4:18 pm 
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The nightmare scenario for me is a visual pet I really want gated behind content that requires a group that I don't have ready access to. Even with group finder, my lock has gotten a grand total of ONE Ritual of Dooms done because I play at weird hours (though speaking of which, it is actually normal hours now and I just got my second one, aw ye). I have friends that will occasionally help me with stuff that still requires multiple people, but accessing more than one of them at a time is real difficult, especially if I feel like I'm on a time limit for some reason (finding a friend with heroism for the grimtotem spirit wolf tame back when was super frazzling, even if by the time my hunter had gotten high enough level Blizzard had said they didn't plan on changing it to be untameable).

If there was a pet in a battleground or arena, it would mean that the hunter would not be assisting their teammates while going after it—there's already enough of that in existing pvp, I think. Raiding is potentially a little different as you can enter the instance without actually technically being in raid time. I guess they could add an item to spawn a pet that you needed rating for, in much the same way that the elite pvp mog is available, but that doesn't sit very well with me either (the exclusive pvp stuff never has; mythic gear is farmable after the fact but the elite stuff isn't).

Either way, my vote is no; making old content tameable is totally fine and I like that a lot to be honest, but it should never be in current group content or require significant assistance from other players (and by the nature of the beast, PvP is always current)

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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 4:25 pm 
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Quiv wrote:
The whole "solo" aspect of it is what tips me over too. Hunter tames feel like it should be something the hunter does.


This is a big selling point for me, also. I'd love to see a "legendary" tame / special "bonding" quest along the lines of Warlock Green Fire quest chain from MoP - lore bits and then bone-grinding test of skill set... well, whatever remains of it, that is. Tracking, Tranquilizing Shot, Trapping, Scare Beast, Concussive Shot, playing aggro with Distracting Shot Play Dead / Feigh Death, interrupts, Eyes of the Beast, all that, rolled into one glorious, torturous scenario that offers only a shiny pet / some visual effect on existing pet and way to transmog into Thori'dal :D

Ah, and kiting. Let us not forget the kiting (currently am working on Thwarting the Twins on my MM, and whoever at Blizzard decided to have MM kite is really a sadist).


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Unread postPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 7:56 pm 
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Nope.

Nadda.

I don't really have any friends that play WoW. I mostly play by myself, so to gate pets behind group content would be really painful for me. I like challenge tames as much as the next hunter, but relying on group content doesn't have the same sense of personal accomplishment, and it isn't something I would ever find myself doing.

Trying to psyche myself up in order to ask someone to borrow a raid lockout for Lalathin is going to be a million times harder than soloing the mob for the fel wolf ever was.


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Unread postPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 4:34 am 
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Im afraid that's a "no" from me. I'm frankly not a fan of the concept of exploiting player enthusiasm over one thing as leverage to make them populate something else that they don't really want to do. How often do they have to find new ways to try to goad players into PvP? The invention of Warden Towers makes me suspect they're quite desperate, since they can use them to claim players are supporting PvP when they're really not. They finally found a way of claiming that PvE players are doing PvP.

I'm not averse to pets with unique looks appearing in PvP areas, however. This was (perhaps still is?) the case with Ashran. It's not that hard to deal with a battle ground to tame a look. I would be against pets requiring serious devotion to/grinding of a particular niche aspect of the game to obtain.

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Unread postPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 12:35 pm 
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I voted "Yes", since I'm honestly more or less okay with it. I've played other games that have special requirements to obtain a thing (usually centered around PvP). Though I'm not a huge fan, I am one of those people that will "knuckle under" if it's something I want bad enough. There was a wolf in Guild Wars 2 that could only be obtained in a PvP instance, and I got it. There was a weapon in Destiny (my beloved Red Death) that required [x] amount of PvP kills to obtain, etc. I mean, I don't want it to be something that they do all the time for every pet, but I'm okay with the occasional gated pet so that people who do spend time in those things, or who are willing to go through something they don't particularly enjoy, can have something neat to show for it. Granted, I don't think it should necessarily be rated BGs or Mythic raids - LFR and LFBG are acceptable.

To be wholly honest, I DESPISE camping. I can't stand sitting in one spot for hours on end waiting for something to spawn. And you're still susceptible to the random jerks that kill your tame just for the fun of it, so I don't think PvP would change things that much. I would so much rather do BGs or a raid or whatever to obtain a pet. I've done my share of camping in my younger years, and it's just not something I can stomach anymore. Thus, I end up not getting the pets that require it. But, that's my choice. There are tons of other pets out there for me to choose from. I'm not going to die if I don't get Loque'nahak. Besides, I think I like Gon better anyway, and I got admittedly lucky on that one. :lol:

I dunno, I think I'm rambling but my point is that I don't have an issue with it as long as it's infrequent. I don't have Fenryr yet, but I know it's MY CHOICE to not main my hunter. I can eventually get it, and I'm okay with that. I don't hold it against them that it's gated behind soloing a Mythic. If I want it bad enough, I'll work for it, or wait.

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Unread postPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 1:04 pm 
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Wain wrote:
Im afraid that's a "no" from me. I'm frankly not a fan of the concept of exploiting player enthusiasm over one thing as leverage to make them populate something else that they don't really want to do. How often do they have to find new ways to try to goad players into PvP? The invention of Warden Towers makes me suspect they're quite desperate, since they can use them to claim players are supporting PvP when they're really not. They finally found a way of claiming that PvE players are doing PvP.


I like the towers because it allows me to get PVP marks by doing PVE content :lol: But I never thought of them using it as a way of getting more raiding/pvp participation. Thats a big scary. Can Blizzard get banned for exploiting us or is that a clever use of game design? ;)


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Unread postPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 2:17 pm 
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Out of nowhere: I suddenly remembered there were Cloud Serpent hatchling battle pets in Mists of Pandaria, tied to the reputation and available for pet battling after hitting Exalted. I no longer remember what reputation it was, but most of it was taking place in The Arboretum :D

I'm surprised there are no hunter pets locked behind the reputation yet. Closest being Skarr and Karkin, requiring Molten Front quests done to a certain point to be able to access their areas.
Or Jandvik Ripfangs who were locked out of tame once you did enough quests in Suramar * still salty *

Rhyela wrote:
I voted "Yes", since I'm honestly more or less okay with it. I've played other games that have special requirements to obtain a thing (usually centered around PvP). Though I'm not a huge fan, I am one of those people that will "knuckle under" if it's something I want bad enough. There was a wolf in Guild Wars 2 that could only be obtained in a PvP instance, and I got it. There was a weapon in Destiny (my beloved Red Death) that required [x] amount of PvP kills to obtain, etc. I mean, I don't want it to be something that they do all the time for every pet, but I'm okay with the occasional gated pet so that people who do spend time in those things, or who are willing to go through something they don't particularly enjoy, can have something neat to show for it. Granted, I don't think it should necessarily be rated BGs or Mythic raids - LFR and LFBG are acceptable.


Honestly, despite voting "No", I agree. If we approach Hunter pets from a position that loosely equals them to mounts or battle pets, as in, cool visual, no real advantage over something available easier, it only makes sense that there would be tames related to different types of end-game content. The details of requirements can vary from achievements to reputation to item. There is only one thing I'm very adamant about: these type of tames should not go away alike to Elite PvP sets or require high rating, PvP wise / Heroic+ Raiding while it is current (Curve / Edge achievement). Everything else is a fair game.


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