A pet for every situation.

[Loffter]

I released my sprit beast v_v he just couldnt stand up to other dps pets, and I needed the slot.

So here is where I stand.

Wasp, Devilsaur, Wolf, Worm, Bear

The wasp is obviously for boss debuffing when no druid.
Devilsaur is for BM dps for now. Eventually when I respec my BM built to be more pvp oriented, this may change.
Worm- I have been in many 5 mans, and a 10 man which did not have a warrior.
Bear- 5 man dps. Thunderstomp + swipe is simply too good to pass up considering most fights are AoEfests.
Wolf- If there is a druid to fire, then I'll use this guy.

So right now, I am having 2 problems. My first is- How large is the DPS difference between, say, survival and BM? How many physical attacking units would need to be in a group to warrent me going BM for worm (With no warrior) rather than staying survival and useing my Wolf (Or wasp if needed). is BM Dps so bad that I will never be able to use my devilsaur if I am trying to be serious with my numbers? Does anyone know the answers to these burning questions?

I almost feel like I will never use my devilsaur, and My worm will not do any good beyond 10 man (though to be fair, he will be my pvp pet I think). Just wondering if there is another situation I should account for and ditch my Devilsaur. I actually considered a Rhino for 25 mans, if there is enough Warriors/rogues/feral druids/hunters with cats. With enough bleeds going around, it might push him over the top.

[Saturo]

Tough it has improved a bit, I wouldn't consider BM raid worthy just yet. However, if no warrior or rogue is available, it is worth it to get the worm. Just make sure the raid knows why your DPS is suddenly so low.

[Loffter]

Tough it has improved a bit, I wouldn't consider BM raid worthy just yet. However, if no warrior or rogue is available, it is worth it to get the worm. Just make sure the raid knows why your DPS is suddenly so low.

Exactly, but for instance, last night. We had a DK and myself and a ret pali ( the DK was the tank), so I brought out the worm. The warlock in the group told me that the worm was a waste, I should get a dps pet. I was wondering if he was right. Was the 20% armor reduction worth dropping my own dps to boost the pali and DKs output? That is, was the difference between getting out my wolf and useing my worm substantial? I wish I knew how to calculate armor damage reduction, I think a basic answer would be "You would need X amount of physical damagers in a group to make a worm viable with no warrior".

The Rhino question also applies. How many bleed effects would one need to justify a rhino? 4? 5?

[Saturo]

I don't think you can ever justify the bleed. The rhino is too much of a dps drain for you to make it viable, even if the raid is composed of mostly rogues.

And in that situation the worm would have been better than the wolf, in BM spec. If you were SV or MM you should stick to the wolf. Even if you could switch between the specs the wolf would overall be greater DPS.

[Loffter]

Alright, so it would have to be more than 3 melee to justify a worm.. And survival is aparently far superior in dps, which makes me conclude that I should pretty much never be BM in a 10 man or higher. I guess I have a pet slot open for taming something, now to decide what and why..

[Gimlion]

As much as i like canines and wolves, i would honestly say Screw them, as it is, raptors give a better overall dps boost anyways, but really any Ferocity pet could give you decent enough added damage, that the margin between them and the tops are so minimal that it won't make a difference until severe high-end raiding. I love wolves, but they are SO overused and for poor reason (/strangle cookie-cutters) but nothing i can change of it...

[Loffter]

As much as i like canines and wolves, i would honestly say Screw them, as it is, raptors give a better overall dps boost anyways, but really any Ferocity pet could give you decent enough added damage, that the margin between them and the tops are so minimal that it won't make a difference until severe high-end raiding. I love wolves, but they are SO overused and for poor reason (/strangle cookie-cutters) but nothing i can change of it...

Ugh, I know trust me. But there are so many people and guilds who won't let you raid or just downright give you crap if you don't min/max. I am just trying to tailor the mins and maxes to my own ends =D

[kamoodle5]

You'd be amazed how much you can impress people with pets they never expect to be useful or worthy in raids or pvp; some people are just too stubborn to accept your decision as to what pets you wish to tag along with you. Only something like a party is getting close to wiping and the pet comes in to save the day can convince people.

[Serendipity82]

I have 3 DPS Pets, one tank pet and a cunning. The Corehound and the cat I keep for 5 mans, while I normally bring out the wolf for raids in my SV spec (BM is WAY more fun btw).

And while I generally raid with the wolf, there have been times where the raid leaders ask me to bust out the Rhino - either to help take care of adds or to off tank. So, I think there are situations where pets from other trees are useful.

[Arkiss]

I agree that some guilds and raiders in general can be bad for pet discrimination (which is to say get your wolf or GTFO) though I've been fortunate enough in my own dealings. Doing Naxx 10 for the first time my GM had a strict wolf-only policy because...well, I'll be honest, we all sucked and we needed all the dps we could get. Doing VoA 25 now I'm almost always the only one with a wolf, and only because I love my vargul blighthound's bouncy animation. I see a lot of cats, raptors and devilsaurs, but tallstriders, spirit beasts and bizarrely dragonhawks are all well-represented.

Doing heroics is a great way to let the pet shine, since your gorilladin or warp-stalker can save the group from a Failtank wipe and provide some much-needed aggro control in stickier situations.

Personally, as a casual player, if someone has a problem with my dps pet, they can shove it. I play to have fun, not get bossed around by Minmax the paladin.

[Gigglemonsta]

I have all 4 spirit beasts, and a Croc for tanking.

I raid as BM, with a spirit beast. The difference between surv/marks and BM is roughly 10%. That said 99% of the time in raids I flog most survival/mm hunters anyway.

BM is not as bad these days as most people think for raids. While technically yes Surv/Marks is slightly more dps, It's better to play the spec you prefer the most, and the spec you are most skilled at.

I have actually had guildies swap their hunters to BM from Surv after seeing how well I can go.

My hunter is only my alt however, so Im usually in alt runs/pugs, but as a decent example in a pug toc 10 man, I was pulling around 6k dps, topping the charts. I know I'm not raiding in the ideal spec, with the ideal pet, but hey, I actually enjoy being the underdog, and surprising people who think that I'll be doing 2k dps in a 25 man just because im BM and I don't have a wolf.

I personally love doing VoA pugs. All the survival hunters always whisper me (most better geared) saying "OMG ur raiding as BM, whats it go like? I wish I could be BM!!" - only to see my beat them in DPS on the boss! I actually managed to go to a "guild run" of a voa 10 the other day on my hunter, and I topped DPS much to their survival hunters dismay!

Im not going to lie and say that BM is better, I am going to say that it is viable though. Give it a go sometime I personally play BM because I love collecting pets, and prefer the spec, and its only my alt, who cares if people don't like what spec I am. That said, I have never been turned down from a raid because I'm BM (main is pretty well known on the server tho), and I am usually one of the top few dps.

=> As a side note, the ALL attack power gems are a myth. A hunter spreadsheet actually shows me gaining 2dps with full raid buffs (25 man), if I had agi gems. AP gems seem to be better with less buffs however, so theres no need to regem to try BM.

I'd say if you can convince your raid leader, go along with your Devilsaur, and see how you go

[Gimlion]

As much as i like canines and wolves, i would honestly say Screw them, as it is, raptors give a better overall dps boost anyways, but really any Ferocity pet could give you decent enough added damage, that the margin between them and the tops are so minimal that it won't make a difference until severe high-end raiding. I love wolves, but they are SO overused and for poor reason (/strangle cookie-cutters) but nothing i can change of it...

Ugh, I know trust me. But there are so many people and guilds who won't let you raid or just downright give you crap if you don't min/max. I am just trying to tailor the mins and maxes to my own ends =D

Luckily it isn't all the top guilds... like my guild is ranked 4th on Nordrassil Alli side, they could honestly give a rats ass which pet i took, except maybe a tenacity pet... but i wouldn't bring one anyways.