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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:20 am 
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Thinking about it more, I think that if there was a way to get off a flight path at any point you wished, I might never use a flying mount at all.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:23 am 
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cowmuflage wrote:
I did not see many people complain about what they did in MOP. I could be wrong tho.



Its pretty much the norm each expansion to delay flight till max lvl and then add a hefty fee to it. The only difference this time is you won't "insta-fly" at 100. And I don't think it's ever been complained about before because alot just zoom through the lvls, atleast this time we might slow down and smell the pixel roses abit ^.^

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:26 am 
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If they follow the same route with Timeless Isle for getting around, then it wont be as painful. Making the ground mounts faster would help as well. They would need to revamp the flight path system and make it more useful, and have more of them. It's a pretty big kick in the pants to be told No, you can't fly is rather annoying for me. However, as much I as I dislike this. I know better to wait and see how the expansion turns out.

Castile wrote:
Its pretty much the norm each expansion to delay flight till max lvl and then add a hefty fee to it. The only difference this time is you won't "insta-fly" at 100. And I don't think it's ever been complained about before because alot just zoom through the lvls, atleast this time we might slow down and smell the pixel roses abit ^.^


Not me. I've never liked leveling, which is Ironic for all the alts I have. I do all the questing the first time around, and each alt I lvl up I quest less and less. I do dungeons, or battlegrounds to get XP.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:38 am 
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cowmuflage wrote:
I did not see many people complain about what they did in MOP. I could be wrong tho.


You mean the double gating thing to get rep gear ?

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:16 am 
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AdamSavage wrote:
If they follow the same route with Timeless Isle for getting around, then it wont be as painful. Making the ground mounts faster would help as well. They would need to revamp the flight path system and make it more useful, and have more of them. It's a pretty big kick in the pants to be told No, you can't fly is rather annoying for me. However, as much I as I dislike this. I know better to wait and see how the expansion turns out.

Castile wrote:
Its pretty much the norm each expansion to delay flight till max lvl and then add a hefty fee to it. The only difference this time is you won't "insta-fly" at 100. And I don't think it's ever been complained about before because alot just zoom through the lvls, atleast this time we might slow down and smell the pixel roses abit ^.^


Not me. I've never liked leveling, which is Ironic for all the alts I have. I do all the questing the first time around, and each alt I lvl up I quest less and less. I do dungeons, or battlegrounds to get XP.

I just...I am genuinely puzzled. We're getting flying in the first patch. No it's not instantaneous, but it's really not going to be a long wait. I hardly think they need to revamp or rework any major systems just for a short period of time while we level and explore the new world they're creating. Ground mounts are a thing, they've been a thing since Vanilla, and it really isn't that crippling. I'm sorry, but I just honestly don't see why a momentary delay (not a permanent one) in obtaining flight is cause for any of this. We're used to getting around on the ground during the beginnings of new expansions, a brief extension of that doesn't seem like it's going to put a major damper on anything.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:26 am 
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Indeed I mean in MOP we could not fly at first (not unless you grinded like crazy) and I saw hardly anyone bitch about it then. Are people really that impatient that they can't wait until the first patch? Really?

A bit of patience goes a long way!

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:34 am 
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I'm looking forward to no-flying. My first toon spent his first 45 (!) levels until he could ride his first SLOW mount (I didn't have the gold to buy riding at 40). I still think back to these times as my best in WoW. Running around with aspect of the cheetah until level 40 is something noone could imagine anymore, but I really didn't mind. Everyone was on foot. And the feeling to buy the first mount with hard earned gold. I still remember my awe at the people who had already reached level 70 (it was TBC) and had those pretty looking fast ground mounts.
I had the best times exploring every piece of a zone on foot or with my slow mount. Climbing up hills and searching for paths to maybe find some hidden spot. For me the best thing of an expansion is when you can ride through the new zones and everything is new. Every other player is on ground mount too. You see so many people, it makes the world feel more alive, more special. I wouldn't mind if they never introduced flying for the whole expansion and just kept it to the old zones.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:00 am 
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I rather like being forced to use ground mounts at the beginning of new expansions. Makes me take the time to look around, explore, stratagize about how the heck I am going to get that shiny without pulling the whole camp. It's fun!! Going through ground mounts I haven't used in so long, and letting them stretch their legs. Then there is that really awesome feeling when I finally get to fly, and then its off to more exploring, and death from above!!!

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:28 am 
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I really look forward to this! While I like the convenience of my flying mounts, I really enjoy letting my pretty ground mounts out to play as well and what's more, I LOVE seeing people in the world. No, not people hovering in the air or swooshing past me on their dragons, but actually riding on the ground like it would be if the game was a real world. People everywhere in their "cars" on their way to different places. I don't know, I just get a lot of pleasure from that. And come 6.1, we'll all be flying again for convenience. I also don't really see what the issue is, but to each their own, as Veph so correctly put it.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:37 am 
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I wonder what "Lore" reason they use for not being able to fly...?

1st we didn't know how to fly in the cold, I wonder what happened to hot weather flying, is that even a thing?
(Cold Weather Flying)

Then we had to get our Master license to fly on Azeroth, clearly we must have been on our "Probationary" plates before the cataclysm came along
(Flight Master's License)

Then we had to learn about not one, not two and not three!... but FOUR! winds before we could fly in Pandaria
(Wisdom of the Four Winds)

My guess is....
(Master's Wisdom of the "Savage" Weather)

;)

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:01 am 
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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:14 am 
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Quote:
Update: So a couple things I wanted to bring up in addition to what I posted earlier. The first was that we're of course refining our questing experience, you may have heard a bit about it from BlizzCon, and that expands to max level content as well. In Mists of Pandaria there was quite a bit of outdoor content at max level, but it was almost entirely in the form of dailies. From BlizzCon we shared we're looking to provide something quite a bit more story driven like the 5.1 Operation Shieldwall/Dominance Offensive with some of the exploration lessons we learned from the Timeless Isle, and that extends to the max level experience as well. We want the transition at max level not to be questing and story to a harsh "now you do dailies", but something that's more natural and feels a lot like the leveling experience just at max level for better reward. And so that goes back to all of the reasons I gave before about how flight interrupts some of the core mechanics we think present the best leveling and questing experience, and I thought it'd be good to point out that it'll also play a big role at max level due to our questing refinements.

The second thing is we really like when flying feels like a reward and something you've earned for each new expansion or area. It's such a powerful ability and we look back at BC (at least for epic riding) or Wrath and those were really big keystone achievements for us as players (mainly because they had some pretty huge gold costs on them...). Regardless of the unlock method though it was one of the bigger moments when you unlocked flying, took to the skies, and were able to see the world from an entirely different vantage because for most of us it wasn't easily attainable. Our plan has been to recapture some of that but make it a bit cooler, and while we don't have specifics just yet, it'll be something more involved than just paying gold; something that further emphasizes how powerful flight is. Unlocking it won't just be level 100 on the day 6.1 comes out with some gold, but something you'll be working toward over the course of the initial expansion release, and 6.1 will introduce the final steps to complete it. Think of something like a mini Legendary cloak quest. It's such a enormous power to be able to fly we really want it to be more of a key moment when you unlock it, and something that feels like an accomplishment more than just shelling out some gold like we've had in the past.

Anyway, I felt like those two things were worth spelling out.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 6:30 am 
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More than just gold to earn it? Interesting... I am glad to hear though that they're trying to give cap players something else to do with their day than 'just' the daily grind. I'd much rather have story content to work through than just daily grinds. As for having to wait for flying... Well we normally have to wait, anyway, so it's nothing new. Let's not go sounding spoiled now and want it all right now. Flying is 90% convienience, not requirment. Time to hike up those big boy pants and get out there and explore all the new things! I'd buy a new pair of shoes for the occasion but, well, tauren...

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 8:45 am 
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I like the new system, and I don't mind waiting a bit for flying. I didn't miss flying while leveling in MoP (well... maybe when questing in the Wastes, just a bit :P ) and I think I would be ok with staying flightless for a while longer. Also, the wanding world bosses and felreaver-type mobs sneaking at you from behind will surely make it all the more exciting without us having an ability to just swoop in circles around their heads.

I am one of the complaining folks for MoP flying, though, just for one reason. Flightless questing sure is fun, but after the n-th alt you seriously have enough of it and would like to try some other way - like archeology or gathering - but without flight those are just outrageous. Also, not being able to fly as a lowbie when max-lvls can do so makes you not only a free-HK on a pvp serv, but also a seated duck.
I would love to see again what they did in WotLK - a thome your main could buy for the alties, for them to be able to fly from the start of their adventure in the new world.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 12:03 pm 
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There's another side to this... the economy.

The delay in flying is going to help all the folks with gathering professions stay on a more even level, because you won't have the guys who grind to 100 in 2 days suddenly in control of the herb and materials markets. It will also at least initially shut down some of the bots that destroy these markets as well. Everyone will be on a more level playing field.

I don't mind the delay, but am now a bit sad that I dropped mining for LW, as it might be prudent to have mining when not being able to fly for a few months... oh well.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:21 pm 
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Ooh, loving the sound of how we'll unlock flying with more than just gold. Looking forward to this! :)

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:32 pm 
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Vephriel wrote:
Ooh, loving the sound of how we'll unlock flying with more than just gold. Looking forward to this! :)

Me too!

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:52 pm 
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Vephriel wrote:
Ooh, loving the sound of how we'll unlock flying with more than just gold. Looking forward to this! :)


I like it even less now.. That being said, it's either deal with it or be behind by several months. Also, I'm curios to see if they will make the flight paths better, and more direct then what they are now. I hoping it wont be as painful as I thought it might be. The only thing that is really going to suck, is trying to mine or collect herbs. Plus the fact I will have to repeat this quest on each alt as I lvl them up..

Hopefully, they make the quest fun and quick. I guess the only thing I can do, is sit back and see how things turn out.

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:33 pm 
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The Devs have always said that after arena, flying was the thing that they regretted the most putting in the game.

Adam.. read my point above. This might actually help with mining and herbing, as you won't have druids who leveled in 2 days dropping from the sky to steal your node. And it will help them control bots. It will also help keep the fast levelers from maximizing all the rares/treasures.

despite the fact that I'm an AH goblin, I welcome this...

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Unread postPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:24 pm 
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Slickrock wrote:
The Devs have always said that after arena, flying was the thing that they regretted the most putting in the game.

Adam.. read my point above. This might actually help with mining and herbing, as you won't have druids who leveled in 2 days dropping from the sky to steal your node. And it will help them control bots. It will also help keep the fast levelers from maximizing all the rares/treasures.

despite the fact that I'm an AH goblin, I welcome this...


Well atleast they admitted they caused this problem. Cata only made it worse, as you got to fly while questing. If it that's bad of a thing, then why not simply remove flying from the game ? They already heavily restrict the use of flying as it is, why not just go all the way. They regret bringing flying into the game, but they continue to encourage it with new mounts and even timeless isle kites you can buy. It's like, they can't seem to make up their mind on what to do about flying.

I wonder if this is a test to see if they can have a expansion without flying at all, and how the population will react to it. Ignoring the claims they don't plan to remove it. Blizzard changes there mind all the time, and often without warning.

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