New Computer Help?

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Kirrandria
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New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

Alrighty, this is a strange thing to be asking on these forums, but I figured there would be somebody here that is able to help!

I'm looking to buy a new computer for gaming. While the one I have is still quite decent (Heck, I'd even say good), I have had it for a few years. Some parts have been replaced, mostly upgraded but there has been a downgrade or two (namely my poor hard drive. Old one friend and it got replaced with a slightly crappier one by the repair people). I'm sure in another year or two I'd be looking to replace more parts, and considering the cost of that I've decided it would be better to just get a whole new system and hold off on having to replace anything for a number of years yet (at least, hopefully.)

First thing first, I would LOVE to build my own PC, but alas I have clumsy hands and know I would break something in the process. I also don't really know anyone else capable of helping to assemble a computer save for computer shops, which all seem to overcharge in my area. I know it's probably the best thing to do when getting a gaming computer, but it's a fair bit more research than I'm used to and I'm not comfortable enough with assembly to actually try it.

Hmm, I have... a $750-$1000 dollar budget for this, roughly (I can spend a bit more, but once I've taken shipping and anything else into effect...). I've already looked at this computer , which a friend of my mother's found. It looks nice, but I'm not sure how much of a step up it is from my current computer or how it compares to other computers in the price range. I really only want to commit to buying a new one if

A. It's a noticable step up from my current system and
B. I won't have to worry about replacing parts to keep up for about 4 or 5 years

Does anybody have any ideas? Opinions? .... Have something you need answered?
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Anyia »

Could you give some specs on what you currently have, such as what CPU, how much RAM and which graphics card? It would give us something more concrete to compare against :)
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

Yes! Currently have an AMD Athlon II x4 630 processor, about 700 gig storage space and 8 GB of RAM (certainly doesn't feel like I have that much RAM X_X), and for a graphics card an NVIDIA GeForce CTX 750 Ti.

None in bad condition, just all a few years old (save for my graphics card, got that late last year) and not in the newest or greatest condition.
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Anyia »

Alright, I'll take a stab at this for you. It has been a few months since I was spec'ing out what I'd like to upgrade my box to, though I haven't felt well enough off to justify it yet. Also, I do build from parts myself, so my views are biased in that direction.

In terms of CPU, the common consensus seems to be that for gaming Intel is superior to AMD these days, and the best bang for the buck is probably the Core i5-4590. Considering I've only recently maxed out my 6+ year old processor, the Core i5 should last well.

With RAM, I wouldn't go below 16GB if you're wanting to be a bit future proof, 32GB if it's at a good price. I haven't run Win10 in any serious form to have an idea of how it and games run on it.

When it comes to graphics cards, it's largely a case of how much money you want to burn. Your existing GTX 750 Ti is excellent price/performance (and it's also what I upgraded to earlier in the year). If you're wanting to go a bit gruntier/pricier than that, it's probably the GTX 970 (which is a step up from the R9 380 you linked, btw). Get a model with 4GB+ of graphics RAM. That RAM can be the bottle neck in terms of graphics quality since it is used to hold all the textures (surfaces) used for rendering a scene. The more RAM, the more complex and detailed scene you can get. Glossing over all the processing details of course! Personally I'm not a fan of the Radeon cards. They typically run hotter than the Nvidia and thus end up producing more noise. Also, I haven't forgiven ATI for their historically terrible drivers which caused me more crashes than I can count (though I can't say anything about their current drivers, they might be fine).

In terms of hard drive there's not a lot of choice to be made - go with whatever has a good size/price ratio. If you can afford it, add a 120GB+ SSD to install Windows on - it makes a *big* difference.

In terms of prices, here's a rough break-down:
CPU (Core i5-4590) $200
16GB DDR3 RAM $80 (or $160 for 32GB)
GTX 970 $350
Hard drive $100
120GB SSD $50 (or $80 for 240GB)
Motherboard ~$100
Case ~$80
--------------------------
~$960 (or $1070 for higher options)

The above is roughly what I'd consider a worthwhile upgrade step compared to what you already have (which is quite similar to what I run, though I have an old Intel Q9450 processor). The system you linked isn't bad, but for the money I would've liked to have gotten a bit more - an Intel processor and a bit more RAM at least. Having a bit of a look around newegg I'd say this one is more what I would suggest though it's just outside your price range. If you're willing to go for an Open Box, that's available too. I personally wouldn't, but I thought I'd toss the idea out there.

If you were anywhere near me I'd be happy to walk you through an actual assembly - it really is quite straight forward these days! There should be plenty of how-to videos up on Youtube too for that matter. And hey, even if you don't build this one, you could always practice and gain some confidence by taking apart and reassembling your old one afterwards :D
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Re: New Computer Help?

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I agree about RAM, I almost feel my current 8GB isn't enough. That system looks pretty nice, though it seems to have a lot of complaints about frequently blue-screening, which either seems to be tied to either the processor or the ram. I'm alllllmost tempted to go ahead and build, assuming I can find someone to help me, just because I could get the bigger RAM and better SSD and seemingly still have it be around 20 bucks cheaper. However, I'm uncertain if I would also have to purchase Windows if I did this? I also don't know if any of the individual parts would come with warranty like the complete system does, in the event it really is the processor that is causing the bluescreens. If I have to pay for those, plus shipping for some parts, it probably would be cheaper to go with the already built system.

Edit: I've been asking around about this in a few places, was also linked to this http://www.ibuypower.com/Store/Intel-Z9 ... nfigurator , which I haven't compared to the system you linked yet. Plus Windows, it'd be 999, which doesn't seem too bad at all. Possibly a good choice? Double Edit: Maybe not, doesn't seem to have 16GB RAM or a 4GB graphics card.
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Anyia »

All parts come with warranty, but you won't have the option of on-site repairs of course, and if you need to send something off for replacement it's a bit of a hassle. The only things I've needed to do that with has been hard drives though, and I've done that mostly out of principle.

I don't know much about Windows licensing. I bought a 3-pack of Win7 some years ago so I haven't really paid much attention on that front. I'm being pestered by Windows to upgrade it for free to Win10 though.

Over the *mumble* years I've been using & building PCs, I've only ever seen one faulty processor* and that was at work this year (and it might've been the motherboard, I didn't have time to really investigate). Most bluescreens are caused by shonky drivers, commonly graphics drivers. The second most common cause in my experience is bad RAM. Whenever you get/build a new system, it's a good idea to run a memory check overnight on it. In case of errors, simply reseating the RAM modules often fixes the problem. The other cause I'll mention is overheating, which can lead to various odd behaviours including bluescreens. Typically you'd only get that problem if your fans & heatsinks are all clogged up with dust, or some muppet forgot to put the thermal paste on the CPU cooler before mounting it.

There are advantages going either way regarding build vs pre-built, only you can make the decision on which is best for you. You have more control when building, but when something doesn't work the only one you can throw the box at saying "fix it!" is yourself. On the other hand, you might not be any worse at fixing the issue than the professionals (see earlier reference to "muppet" in this post...)

*) Assuming you don't count the floating point issue on some Pentium models, or the Pentium F00F issue.
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

xD Yeah, sometimes I feel I could easily work with computers... and I barely know anything about them. But then I remember I tried to take apart my current one when my graphics card failed some time ago to see what was wrong (and clean it out, this room is horribly dusty) and ended up having to send it in to be fixed because I dropped a screw -inside- the power supply and couldn't get it back out....

Hmm, it seems that if it isn't the processor then it's the RAM, and if it's just a matter of reseating it (which, tech illiterate person that I am, assume means adjust how it's attached in my computer?) that won't be hard to fix at all. And if all else fails, these people seem to have tech support that responds very quickly and I have the ability to send it back for repairs.
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Anyia »

Dropping screws while working on computers is perfectly normal. Either that or I'm totally abnormal :D Just bad luck (or case design) it ended up in the power supply. It could happen to anyone, don't read too much into it.

And yeah, reseating = pull out the RAM module, blow the socket clean (probably mostly superstition tbh), then put it back in again. It seems sometimes there can be a bit of build-up on the contacts, and the act of pulling it out and putting it in again scrubs that off, and everything starts working.

Good luck with whichever approach you end up going with!
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

Oh wow, I'm posting in here again xD

I did end up getting the computer that some people said they had experienced crashing issues with (this one), because the problem seemed rare enough, and roughly 2-3 months had passed since the last reported issue at the time I bought it. Go figure, I finally set the thing up today and within about 8 hours (the reported time it took most people's to crash) it ends up crashing and restarting itself in the middle of me playing Fallout.

Sadly, tech support has gone to bed for the night, so I can't call them until I wake up, but I noticed we had figured the issue likely either being bad graphics drivers or faulty RAM (or I guess poorly seated RAM, but). I wanted to ask, before I call support sometime tomorrow, if anyone knew how to check if it is in fact either of these? I'm going to run the memory test you linked me, Aniya, but how do I 'read' the results I get back to know if it is or isn't caused by my RAM?
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Re: New Computer Help?

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How does it act right before it crashes? Like does it blue screen, just freeze, make a bad sound then shutdown, also can you hear it "thinking" a lot right before the crash, do the fans turn off then it crashes? :mrgreen:

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Re: New Computer Help?

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Alright, I ran a memory check (the one built into windows 10), and it came back up with no detected problems whatsoever. Then my internet service decided to crap out for a while X_X But I'm finally back on.

Tried playing Fallout 4 again, and it nearly immediately crashed. Graphics issue then, maybe?

The first time it did it, the computer actually crashed and restarted itself (no actual blue screen, just... off and back on again), second time it just froze. Seriously, I just got this thing and there's probably already damage to the hard drive. It made a weird sound both times, in the sense that it kinda slowed down.

Edit: I cannot tell if the computer is thinking hard or if the fans stop before it crashes. I have no speakers right now, and with headphones on it's impossible to hear what the computer itself does. I don't want to try and force it to crash to see what it does, as I'm rather opposed to the idea of causing it any more damage.

Edit 2: Most certainly a graphics driver issue... er, or I'm getting over confident on what I've 'discovered'. Updated a couple of them, tried to run my game on lower settings, and it actually ran smoother and longer before finally crashing. And when it crashed, it didn't take my computer with it! Yay, I guess. Even gave me a very brief error message that said something about drivers, though I didn't have a chance to read it, being as it disappeared when I tried to click on it. Oh well, I guess I have a good idea what the problem is, now to just figure out how to fix it. My comp theoretically should be all up to date with drivers...
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Re: New Computer Help?

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Ok, sorry I dozed off, then woke up with "Kirra needs help playing the best game evvaaa" so I have a few more questions and I may have to consult the manmeat in the morn if I'm not 100% on what I think is wrong, OK? Ok then, did you get that annoying prompt from NVIDIA to optimize your driver for FO4, SW:Bf, and SC II? If so did you download the driver? If not run the NVIDIA GFE and click check for updates (don't include beta drivers) and do what they say. If they are updated, reinstall them. Oh and if it gives you that 0.0 kb ready to download crap, goto the site and manually find ur driver and download the update. Ok I need sleep, I will wait a bit then goto bed and talt to u tommarow. :hug: :mrgreen:

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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

Yep, updated drivers and tried to run the best game ever on Medium xD That's when it crashed to desktop rather than crash my whole computer and gave me that very brief drivers error message that I was unable to read.
I'm trying to do a clean install of the drivers now, so maaaaybe this'll work.
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Re: New Computer Help?

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Ok good, I'm glad it didn't turn off again, let me how the reinstall went. :mrgreen:

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Re: New Computer Help?

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Any luck Kirra? :hug: :mrgreen:

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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Anyia »

Rawr has been offering excellent advice while I've been asleep! :)

Good idea about using the Windows mem-tester, it's quite good too. If it says everything is a-ok, that's a good start. At this point I concur that it sounds like graphics driver issues. New games are *really* good at bugging out drivers for some reason. You'd think there'd be more testing given the track record...
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

Yep, I've pretty much narrowed it down to a drivers issue xD Seems that NVidia cards and Windows 10 aren't getting along very well - My GTX 970 isn't the only card that seems to be having problems with it. Sucks, because I uninstalled and reinstalled the drivers about ten times now... and updated Windows to boot. At the very least, I've gotten it to the point where it just crashes my game, and not my whole computer. I guess until a real fix has been released, I'll just have to switch back to my old computer. At least that could run Fallout, even if it was on the lowest settings.
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Re: New Computer Help?

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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Kirrandria »

Alright, so far I've tried installing the correct drivers clean from the NVidia website (multiple times, even X_X). I've turned off the NVidia Experience streaming feature, which apparently had caused some people crashing issues by running in the background of a game, and I've also set my NVidia to run at the best performance over running in adaptable mode, which apparently is a fix for some people's issues.

My game runs longer now, but it still crashes at roughly 2-3 minutes in. Since it's running a bit longer, I've noticed some stuttering with the sound and visuals, but only barely. I did finally manage to catch the error message I get when the game crashes long enough to write it down.

"NVIDIA Windows Kernel Mode Driver, Version 358.91 stopped responding and successfully recovered."

It's the message a number of people seem to be getting. Rawr, I think I've gone through and tried everything pertaining to driver crashes that those two links you gave me said to do. Still nada, the best game ever is still crashing X_X
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Re: New Computer Help?

Unread post by Rawr »

I found this

https://www.nvidia.com/download/find.aspx
I reverted, but not that far back, and it didn't work for me. Will report soon on the further back driver.
edit: FIXED! Roll back to 355.60, install the beta version of fallout 4, run as administrator, and launch from GeForce Experience.


This is the Beta for ur driver. See if this works.

http://www.nvidia.com/download/driverRe ... 4233/en-us :hug: :mrgreen:

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