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I don't hate the Horde (I have several 110 Hordes) or the Horde fanbase, but I do not like the direction that Blizz is taking them and Sylvanas.

My opinions are not fact, true, but the things that have been done in past xpacs and are currently being done in the Alpha are.

I don't think it's bizarre to hate a character, and I certainly don't hate the horde. I love the horde side. Characters are written for people to enjoy them, they're made to make people emotional. You either won't care about a character at all, you'll love them, or you'll hate them. I used to really like Sylvanas as a character, I don't like her anymore because of the way blizzard has written her.

I do think its bizarre to put that much effort into hate. Maybe I'm the silly one but seriously it's a game. All of the characters have good and bad.

Syleye wrote:I do think its bizarre to put that much effort into hate. Maybe I'm the silly one but seriously it's a game. All of the characters have good and bad.

They do, that doesn't change the fact that I don't like Sylvanas. I take everything I enjoy very seriously, it's like if you watch a good TV show. You have characters you're going to like and characters you won't like it all. I used to like Sylvanas before they took her direction that I didn't agree with her care for anymore. That doesn't mean I'm right or wrong, it doesn't mean you're right or wrong either. It's all a matter of opinion.

Agreed, Silivren. A big part of writing is drawing emotions from the reader. I also used to like Sylvanas, but Blizz has gradually changed her into a character that I just don't like anymore. Ever since Cata Blizz has been making changes to her that is turning her into a villain. Chronicles Vol 3 has evem retconned lore from Cata to push her being a villain even further.

@Syleye If you think it is bizarre to be so invested, then why do you care so much about Sylvanas or what others think about her?

Oddly off topic, but I don't hate the Horde...I do hate what Sylvanas has become as a character. There is nothing redeeming her for me after all she's done over the past several years of game play. There is little to no good left in her that I can find.

...and ironically I used to play Horde side solely until Sylvanas took control. I loved Vol'Jin. I also strongly dislike Genn and hate Tyrande. Jaina walks a thin line...I'd love to see her stopped before she goes that final bit over the edge for me...Sylvanas wasn't and she has become a villain to me in this story. For the same reasons people have strong dislikes of characters in books and movies, they'll have the same in video games.

That's just it though you recognize it as opinion and are not attacking others. Anyways I am very interested to see how it all plays out. Not looking forward to Warfronts

Now that we have a pretty good idea when the pre-patch will be, I'm starting to feel sick. I'm just not interested in seeing Teldrassil burn and have cancelled my subscription.

I'd like to see Jaina become a raid boss. She seemed a bit unhinged at the start of Legion in Dalaran. I used to like her but after Cata I really do dislike her.

No she wasn't.

The Horde destroyed Theramore. She forgave them for that, and trusted them again. She even told Aethas that if any Sunreavers step out of line again, it's his responsibility and will be his head. He agreed.

The Sunreavers betrayed that trust again and gave Garrosh access to Darnassus through Dalaran, giving him access to the Divine Bell, a weapon of mass destruction. She ejected the Horde from Dalaran and arrested the Sunreavers for treason. (We've been told the Alliance side was the canon side, not the Horde side where she kills people).

Over time (between Mists and Legion), she forgave the Horde AGAIN and trusted them at Broken Shore. Only to have the Horde leave the Alliance to fend for themselves after promising to cover their rear. Yes, there was a reason they retreated, but there was also no warning. Sylvanas could have told them "A horn means retreat." Sylvanas could've seen one of her Val'kyr to the Alliance to tell them to retreat. Etc. But she didn't. The Horde abandoned the Alliance. Jaina had a right to be mad, and a right to not want the Horde in Dalaran.

On top of all of this, she was proven right. Do the mage campaign. A sunreaver, AKA The Horde force in Dalaran, betrayed Azeroth and sided with the Legion, destroying Dalaran's defenses. However, unlike the last 2 times, Aethas took responsibility for the Sunreaver's actions, and made amends by helping the Mages temporarily power the shields with a demon soul while a more permanent replacement was made.

Either way, it proved that Jaina was right to not trust the Horde, specifically the Sunreavers, again.

It felt like she was to me. To each their own.

The Battle for Undercity scenario is up on the Alpha. Sylvanas raises Horde soldiers as skeletons and sends them at the Alliance. :/

Valnaaros wrote:The Battle for Undercity scenario is up on the Alpha. Sylvanas raises Horde soldiers as skeletons and sends them at the Alliance. :/

Why would that be a bad thing?

Tomb wrote:

Valnaaros wrote:The Battle for Undercity scenario is up on the Alpha. Sylvanas raises Horde soldiers as skeletons and sends them at the Alliance. :/

Why would that be a bad thing?

Because they died and should be left to rest? They served their time and didn't consent to undeath? Or because skeletons are not the same as death knights/forsaken/Sylvanas herself. Skeletons are mindless canon fodder, they always have been. I sure don't think it's a good thing to treat your soldiers that have already fought for you once like that, rather gross imho.

Precisely, Silivren. They performed their duty and should be allowed to rest. They didn't give consent for their bodies to be used in such a way, and I'm sure the Orcs and Tauren especially would be very unhappy with their fallen being used like that.

War is hell.

But to quote Garrosh, "...a wise old war hero told me something that I would carry with me forever... "Honor, ... No matter how dire the battle... never forsake it.""

Desperate times call for desperate measures I guess :/

Quiv wrote:War is hell.

But to quote Garrosh, "...a wise old war hero told me something that I would carry with me forever... "Honor, ... No matter how dire the battle... never forsake it.""

Precisely. More and more pieces are falling into place as to why Saurfang doesn't want to have anything to do with Sylvanas' Horde, and I don't blame him at all.

Also, apparently the Alliance is greatly outnumbered at the Siege of Undercity. There are two things that turn the tides in their favor. The first is Jaina, who arrives later on during the Siege and helps the Alliance push into the city. The second is the Gnomes. Sylvanas orders for the Blight to be deployed (which Saurfang is against), which prevents the Alliance from getting into the city. Mekkatorque then sends the Gnome Army via Gyrocopters to fly over the Blight and breach the outer walls.

Does not seem very smart to lay siege to something when you are greatly outnumbered, even if you do get reinforcements later on.

Outnumbered but with superior technology. However, we don't know all that happens between now and the Siege. We know that Sylvanas leads the Horde towards Teldrassil in order to cut-off the Alliance's connection to Azerite on Kalimdor. Datamined dialogue from Sylvanas strongly suggests that she uses Azerite Bombs to burn Teldrassil. After that, we don't know. Anduin could be pressured into sieging UC for all we know.