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Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:34 pm 
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Artisan Hunter
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This new system reminds me of a slightly more complex version of warlock pets, and warlocks have been complaining about that for years. Tank pet, group pet, four (or more) useless abilities on your bars/spellbook.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:45 pm 
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Expert Hunter
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Thinking I may be looking at a new main all these years since Wrath. Well good thing I like Locks as well.


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Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:32 pm 
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Journeyman Hunter
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This is a horrid change. I want to change my pet's spec at will. We're going backward here, not forward. I understand that many of us have said we would like all pets to feel useful, but this isn't a proper step in that direction.

Giving all pets a skill of some sort was good, but locking pet specs is bad. Please let me change my pet's spec. I hate this one change.

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Unread postPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:39 pm 
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Myzou wrote:
If anything, give HUNTERS the heroism spell, so even marksman has it. Just callit something like aspect of the raptor.

Like I said, just give hunters aspects that act as heroism and possibly battle res, so that pets are not required for these (so marksman can also use them, since they're forcing lone wolf on marksman again).

The BFA version of Lone Wolf is NOT the same as the Legion version. You have +18% personal damage if you don't have a pet out. If you call one out you lose that buff since the pet should do around that % of damage. With all the utility coming back for pets there was no way Legion Lone Wolf would stay as is.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:46 pm 
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Journeyman Hunter
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Quiv wrote:
Wowhead suggested they may have locked pets to spec so moth/crane/quillen can't have both Bloodlust (from Ferocity) and Battle Rez (from the family ability). I have looked through the abilities and don't see any other combinations that struck me as "unfair." I don't see why those two are particularly powerful together, but I suppose putting them on one family/spec could make them mandatory in certain situations and no one wants that. No player class has those two naturally.

This leads me to believe the problem isn't with family abilities and pet specs. The problem is this design direction of tying big abilities (mainly Bloodlust) to a spec. so I have to wonder:

Is having powerful abilities like Bloodlust tied to spec a good idea?

Since this is the result, I say no its not. I want specs to have unique abilities and flavor, but lust is too big. This leads me to think that the big abilities like lust and rez need to be rethought. I don't think tying them to a spec (and therefore forcing pets into a spec) is a good idea. I think the pet talent idea is the better solution, even if its only one row where we choose one of the big abilities.

This would give all pets access to rez and lust, but I don't see the big deal with having a devilsaur rez you over a crane. It could be a generic ability like they did with calling Bloodlust "primal rage."

Though to be completely honest, I didn't see a big deal with tying lust and rez to specific families anyway. They were already on an exotic and non-exotic family, and we have 5 call pet slots. We can have them if needed. This part of the changes strikes me as trying to fix something that isn't necessarily broken. I'm glad families got some normal abilities back (although they are woefully boring), but the spec/big ability change was unnecessary.


We can already bring Brez via month/crane and Lust/Hero via LWing drums.

I don't see the pets having both as unfair at all. Someone's dropping the ball at Blizzard and I feel as though it's some new blood they've brought in recently.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:12 pm 
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Signs of Kelani has a good video on it: https://youtu.be/OYbK_7rtwno


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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:21 pm 
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I fail to see the issue here. With damage being normalized among the specs, which pet we use will still be up to personal preference. I foresee viable arguments for using any of the three specs during a raid.

Regarding pet-specific abilities, none of them are mandatory for group content. It is highly unlikely for a progression raiding guild to not already have a few people who bring Battle Rez and Heroism. Mythic+ dungeon runs are the only area where you will be coerced into bringing one of those pets, but that happens *now*, so there is no change.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:42 pm 
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I'm actually ok with this now. I think I was being overly dramatic. *cringe*

The base damage is the same. Each could have their use. And any raid worth it's salt is going to be bringing res and lust in many forms, which means maybe you can bring that movement speed. I can see this working out.

Edit: Though, they better make those families make sense! Boars should be tenacity. Dragonhawks should NOT be. And why is a scalehide not tenacity? Make them fit properly, please!

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:57 pm 
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Illustrious Master Hunter
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Yeah, this really isn't as bad as we all initially thought. Just some tweaking of some of the family specs is what is needed at this point.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:02 pm 
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Illustrious Master Hunter
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Normalized damage is very unexpected, and a little strange to think about after so many years of specs having specific outputs, but that definitely makes this less grim that it originally appeared. Hopefully things work out in the end.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:40 pm 
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I feel like I missed something with this normalized damage thing. Does Ferocity not have Spiked Collar anymore?

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:51 pm 
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It still isn't cool to restrict pet specs after all these years. Hate it very much. I like everything but that. Dunno how some people are ok with it.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:12 pm 
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It isn't bad since all three specs deal the same damage, but each provides different benefits. Instead of always using Ferocity for dungeons and raids, you can bring Tenacity or Cunning and not receive a dps loss.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:36 pm 
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Master Hunter
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I don't see why they're locking families to specs though.

What if I want a mechanical pet that gives me +10% health? What if I want a spirit beast that gives me heroism? What if I want a raptor that gives Master's call?

The changes to the specs aren't bad. They're good.

The spec-locking is terrible though, and a huge step backwards.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:20 pm 
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Valnaaros wrote:
It isn't bad since all three specs deal the same damage, but each provides different benefits. Instead of always using Ferocity for dungeons and raids, you can bring Tenacity or Cunning and not receive a dps loss.

Yes, but utility loss here is very important. Currently, tenacity pets are extremely useful. Ferocity? Hardly compares. Lust is almost always covered & the leech seems very lackluster. The 10% extra HP and extra defensive will be invaluable, ESPECIALLY for survival hunters (where we struggle in melee).

Cunning will still be the go-to for PvP it seems, as master's call is MANDATORY for any hunter.


No. Not digging it. Let me change specs. NOT COOL.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:06 pm 
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The damage thing is fine. The utility locking is not.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:26 pm 
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Myzou wrote:
I don't see why they're locking families to specs though.

What if I want a mechanical pet that gives me +10% health? What if I want a spirit beast that gives me heroism? What if I want a raptor that gives Master's call?


It's the same reason they won't let you tank with your Priest by shooting arrows from your 2H axe. They're moving away from homogenization (in response to player demand), and this is part of that trend.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:27 pm 
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Illustrious Master Hunter
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viaradda wrote:
Myzou wrote:
I don't see why they're locking families to specs though.

What if I want a mechanical pet that gives me +10% health? What if I want a spirit beast that gives me heroism? What if I want a raptor that gives Master's call?


It's the same reason they won't let you tank with your Priest by shooting arrows from your 2H axe. They're moving away from homogenization (in response to player demand), and this is part of that trend.


This, essentially. Players have been complaining about homogenization for years, and so Blizz is doing things like this in order to get away from it.


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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:48 pm 
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I don’t recall widespread complaints about pet homogenization, though.

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Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:04 pm 
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Could just be Blizz taking a look at everything. I recall them mentioning in an interview a while back that they were going to work on Warlock demons, so maybe they decided to do the same to pets?


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