Flying in WoW Discussion

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AdamSavage
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Flying in WoW Discussion

Unread post by AdamSavage »

I guess at this point, it's safe to say they will not allow us to fly at all this expansion.. Say what you will, but this really pisses me off. I paid a large chunk of gold, and put a good amount of effort for my flying mounts... Now, only to be told no flying.. Well expect old content, that doesn't matter anymore. I could always do laps around SW, or IF... That would get boring really fast. I simply can't understand the logic behind this.. They spend more time and effort preventing us from flying, then simply allowing us.. They talk about immersive game play and what not, yet tease us with limited flying with rockets, feather, gliders, wormholes combined with a glider.. This could be a game breaker for me.. I was willing to tolerate waiting till 6.1, but I don't know if I could tolerate the entire expansion with no flying.. I just want to use my flying mount, to fly where I want and when I want, without Blizzard telling me no..
What's the deal currently with your stance on flying, any new developments, or insights?
Overall, we’re happy with how ground travel in Draenor has played out thus far, and we’ve heard a lot of feedback to that effect as well, though we of course recognize that there are players who feel differently. We’ll have more to announce about our 6.1 patch plans in the very near future, but as the focus of our endgame outdoor content remains in the main Draenor zones, our reasons for disallowing flight in 6.0 continue to apply in 6.1. Whether you’re navigating your way to Orumo the Observer in Shattrath Rise, trying to reach a treasure cache atop a column in Spires, or working your way around the ledges encircling The Pit, you’re engaging in gameplay that simply would not exist in a world with unfettered flight. It was never our intent to make large-scale navigation of the world inconvenient, and in 6.1 we’re going to be improving our flight path system to always take the most direct route between two points, even if you have not discovered some of the intermediate nodes. Please keep the feedback coming – if you’re unhappy with the design, some of the most helpful feedback would be specific examples of situations or systems that feel frustrating without being able to fly in Draenor.

Caught this from a poster on the MMO Champion forums.. He made some good points.
You asked for feedback about frustrating situations caused by the lack of flight, so here goes:
Uncrossable, too steep cliffs, hills, and whatnot, making it sometimes bloody frustratingly difficult to find my way to wherever I want to get.
Example: I needed to find a medium tree in Gorgrond to cut down (had to be Gorgrond, quest). Took me minimum half an hour of enormously frustrating bashing my head against the scenery to find a way to the part with medium trees, and then find one. Then as I was eating before cutting it down (as it was going to spawn a hostile mob), another player came by and nabbed it. (to be fair, that's another issue, shared quest credit not being known widely enough - if I'd attack the mob, I'd get kill credit and quest item too, but I didn't know it at the time - there could be an informational message about it on the loading screens, if there isn't yet)
For similiar reasons I'm really, extremely unwilling to touch archeology on Draenor (other than those few fragments I get from garrison mine). Hostile mobs? Sure, whatever, I can handle that. Artificial, frustrating, "prolonging gameplay", by putting all those overly steep hills and slopes and whatnot in the way? That's really frustrating and disheartening from exploration and stuff. (especially in cases like the Gorgrond one described above, when I was just bashing my had against a scenery, unable to find a way across)

Proposed solutions other than flying? Less steep hills and mountains would probably need the remake of the zones, so out of the question, I guess. Ropes like those on some hill in (I think) desert part of Gorgrond (they are there to help reach a rare on top of it), or ladders, etc. More items like the "glider" for non-engineers, the one from that Inn quest require'ing the player to run a heroic, Aviana's feather or so (not everyone might want, or be able to do that for whatever reason), coming from other activities, pvp, archeology, Large garrison building with engineering gadgets (if it doesn't provide one already, I haven't built it), treasures in the world, etc. (or maybe something allowing to jump higher and/or longer distance on short cooldown, that'd help with all those too steep and overly abundant hills and cliffs - by short cooldown, since we're not talking about gliding here, I mean something like 30 seconds, a minute tops)
Last edited by AdamSavage on Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:36 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by cowmuflage »

I'm enjoying not being able to fly way more then I thought I would.

But I disagree that it's "safe to say we wont be able to fly in this expansion". So they say they wont add it in the next patch how do you know they wont the patch after? never say never.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Vephriel »

cowmuflage wrote:I'm enjoying not being able to fly way more then I thought I would.
I've actually really been enjoying myself as well. I was a little skeptical about the no flying, but this expansion has worked absolutely great without it in my opinion. I love the jumping puzzles and how much there is to explore in the world again. I love the fact that I can stumble upon these secret, hidden areas and be rewarded for my curiosity. It's really brought back a sense of nostalgia from the original game, and I just feel like flying would trivialize a lot of that. We still have all our flying mounts, and by this point I'm pretty accustomed to new zones and areas not having flight. I'm fine with waiting longer. I could see Blizz adding flying to Draenor much later when it's older content, but for now I'm perfectly content to go without it.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Danielfboone »

It's both disappointing and infuriating. I bought some FLYING mounts and paid extra for the deluxe edition of WoD just to get the FLYING mount. The feeling of having been lied to and ripped off is very strong.

The jumping puzzles are also stupid and not needed. WoW is not a Mario game.

Having said that, I disagree that it is safe to say that they will never implement it in WoD. I still think they will at some point. They want specific examples of where no flying is inconvenient. I can't give any because it always is. I am not enjoying not having it at all.

If they do want a specific example though there is this. You're camping for hours for one of the rare mounts. The mob finally spawns but at a point far away from you. You run like mad to get there in time to tag it but because other mobs keep dismounting you or making you go the long way around, you don't make it. There's 8-10 hours wasted because you can't use the fastest possible way to get there.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Lisaara »

I'm actually happy there's no flying. At first, I thought I'd hate it. But honestly? Aside from Archeology being a bit annoying, it's not so bad. I'm seeing mounts I haven't seen in a long time(ground mounts) because we could fly everywhere. One thing I wish is for the Random Mount to actually bring up flying mounts that can travel on the ground.

I hope Blizz sticks to their guns and continues this trend. :)

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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by AdamSavage »

cowmuflage wrote:I'm enjoying not being able to fly way more then I thought I would.

But I disagree that it's "safe to say we wont be able to fly in this expansion". So they say they wont add it in the next patch how do you know they wont the patch after? never say never.
They also said, they would probably add flying in with the 1st patch. It didn't take long for them to backpedal and start to hum and ha with the idea. Then sure enough, they say nope. No flying. We like teasing you with limited flying.. The limited flying they give you, goes against the whole "impressive gameplay" Having problems figure out how to get to a place, or want to get there without fighting through a sea of mobs ? Not a problem! Just use your feather or the rockets and zip right by them, or get directly to where you want to go.

The only way I think I could tolerate not flying, is lowering the cooldown on the feather to something like 4-5 minutes. They seem to very intent on making sure we don't fly this expansion.. I don't know if this is the future of wow, or what the case may be. I do know if they remove flying from WOD, they will likely loose quite the large sub base. With all the screws ups this expansion, you think they would just say the heck with it and let us fly..
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by cowmuflage »

Again that does not mean that it's "the end of flying in WoD".
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by AdamSavage »

cowmuflage wrote:Again that does not mean that it's "the end of flying in WoD".
We will see. I'm not holding my breath at this point. I'm nearly given up hope at this point.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Krysteena »

They haven't said a 'No flying, period' in WoD. Give me a couple of patches, and they'll add it.

Personally, I don't mind being able to fly. Sure, it took me 2 hours to get to Shadowmoon Valley, proving I seriously can't read a map and spot the easy route, but in a way it was fun. I had to actually try. There was a lot of death on the way. Mobs actually attacking. Trying to be a mountain climber, and falling to my death because of it.

The world is actually dangerous again. It lacked a certain quality about it, when we were able to fly. You ran the risk of dying. You couldn't out-fly mobs, you have to turn around and engage or play some pirates of the Caribbean and get your arse outta there.

Much more fun this way, I think.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by AdamSavage »

When you are at max lvl you are not really dealing with mobs that much.. The only time is when you do the daily's.. If you have the gearworks building, and you have the rocket pack. You can simply zip up and over them. The same applies with that feather. As a hunter, I can camo past anything I don't want to deal with as well. When that doesn't work, I simply fake death. I could understand making us wait till the first patch... Now they want us to basically wait half the expansion for flying ? IF they even allow it.. I personally have my doubts at this point.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Bowno »

With more than half of the treasure for treasure hunts being in awkward places you either need to wall jump up to, cross ropes or use gliders from NPCs to get to.. Flying would make gathering these things way too easy. Might as well just leave them in a big pile outside your Garrison door.

I could see them possibly adding flying at the very end of the expansion as a new one is coming out.. But before then seems a little unneeded.

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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by AdamSavage »

It's just treasures... You don't have to go get them if you don't want to.. It wont effect your gameplay or raiding. 6.1 is still atleast 3 - 4 months away at this point. That's plenty of time for people to get to most if not all of the treasures. It would be quite silly if that was one of the reasons.. You enjoy being grounded ? Fine. You can stay grounded. Nobody is forcing you to fly. Those who chose to fly can fly.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Bowno »

Treasures give Gold, resources, gear and other items such as toys. Sure, you don't have to get them if you don't want to.. But if you do want to you should get them as it was intended for you to get them. They were added in to give players something to do if they so choose and to make it a slight challenge so they wouldn't get bored and say they had nothing to do.
If you could just fly up there and get them, then congrats, you got them. Yay. But now you're bored again because all you had to do was fly there and not use your head to figure out how to reach them.

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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by AdamSavage »

Bowno wrote:Treasures give Gold, resources, gear and other items such as toys. Sure, you don't have to get them if you don't want to.. But if you do want to you should get them as it was intended for you to get them. They were added in to give players something to do if they so choose and to make it a slight challenge so they wouldn't get bored and say they had nothing to do.
If you could just fly up there and get them, then congrats, you got them. Yay. But now you're bored again because all you had to do was fly there and not use your head to figure out how to reach them.
Spending a half a hour trying to figure out how to get somewhere, just for gear that isn't going to do me much good at max lvl. Isn't my idea of fun.. It's annoying to end.. The expansion is full of them and it drives me crazy! I just want to go where I want to go, and spend the least amount of time getting there. I hate parts of Nagrand for that very same reason. Parts of Shadowmoon Valley are a pain as well. Like I said though.. Most of the treasures will be picked by the time the 1st patch comes out, and with it a new teir of gear.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Bowno »

If they're annoying you don't have to do them. But for some people they enjoy the challenge. While it could be argued that if they enjoy the challenge that they don't have to fly to get them... It doesn't quite work that way. Why work to see if you can get the item, resources, gold or toys in question when you could just fly up there? There's no incentive to do things the way they were intended if you can just flap on over there even if you are a person who likes a bit of a challenge.

I'm not saying there should never be flying. I like to fly. I like being able to reach places quickly and gank people as I dive out of the air. Really, I do! But I think that WoD can wait to get it until we're preparing for something new.

Most of the items are vendor trash, yes. But there are some great items, and of course the gold and resources I keep mentioning.

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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Castile »

Well all the special rare mounts are all ground ones so far so kinda figures they'd delay it. I agree with others that this doesn't mean "ever" probably just prolonging it so people can enjoy exploring and the challenge. I'm liking using my special ground mounts again and running all over. The flight paths are pretty great so right now I don't miss it :)

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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by cowmuflage »

I think the flight paths are the best they've done so far. Apart from the few odd choices that is XD
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Kalhoun »

I'm enjoying the challenge of having to navigate my way around the map. The part that really sticks out in my mind is trying to find quest mobs and "rares" in the various caves of Nagrand. The world very much seems dangerous again, and that's something I have not felt since Vanilla. I have jumped to my doom trying to find shortcuts, and have gone around in circles trying to find a path to the place I want to go, but that's what I did way back in the day too. I've always loved the adventurous, experimental feeling of finding my way around (getting to Gara as a Horde was interesting!). Plus I can use my favorite mount, which is a flying mount, on the ground.

I understand people's frustrations though. I'm sure they will eventually add flight to Draenor in a later patch.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by Azunara »

I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure WoW is one of the only games that have the whole flying mount system. Many of the games I've played in various formats simply didn't have the whole flying mount system. Hell, they didn't have mounts. MMO wise, GW2 is a big one I'm thinking of here without mounts or anything like the sort. RPG wise, Skyrim is huge popular with an endless ton of mountains--and yet everyone's cool with no flying there.

Are the mountains a nuisance some times? Yes. Fine. Whatever. Is it going to be the end of the world if we can't fly anymore? I doubt it. I certainly don't think it's going to be the huge gamer base dropping like you predict Adam--after all, the quick sampling here shows many people are okay with it and that the minor annoyances certainly don't outweigh the fun. If no flying is truly a game breaker, then it's a good thing no one is forcing you to play.
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Re: No Flying in WoD period

Unread post by MaximumOverdrive »

That makes me sad to hear really...I haven't hardly done any extra exploring in the game as I usually did with flying. I find myself making a beeline toward quests now and don't feel like steering off the course. I hope they eventually change this. I think LK did it right for flying originally, and wish they did something similar. While ground hasn't been that bad to do, I just don't explore like I used to now.
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