Store vs In-Game Mount Quality Discussion

A companion forum for Warcraft Mounts. Or just talk about WoW mounts.
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MaximumOverdrive
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by MaximumOverdrive » Wed Aug 12, 2015 10:15 pm

Pepsi Jedi wrote:
MaximumOverdrive wrote:That's why I said put the fancier ones in the store, but leave other, maybe less or no armored ones, available in game. Having to spend an additional $255 plus the monthly subscription for mounts you literally cannot get anywhere else is bad. Even most of the raid and pvp mounts have alternatives that aren't as fancy to help compensate. And for the many mount completionists in game, they'll still buy it.

The price is a bit of another issue as well. $25, at the time, was fine cause they were the only BoA mounts. Now that all mounts are, the price is stupid (and hell more expensive with the mecha horse cause they put some stupid gimmick with it).

This is the only game that gets away with having a sub and store like this. And when they put more work into the store than in game, it's gunna come back to bite them.
It's really not. Microtransactions are found all over the place in video games now. Be it 'skins' or what have you. Look at Star Trek Online. from ships to crew to frigging uniforms can all be bought in the store.

This seems to point back up to one of my proposed guesses. "Some people want everything free in the game"

You don't want to have to "pay" for the mount you want, You want it, or a version of it in the game for free.

Well... part of getting the snazzy cool mount from the store, seems to be that yes, they're not 'as often' duplicated in the game. I.E. you get a little bit of exclusitivity for having paid for the snazzy mount.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Now my question is..... Will the Moose Fly? Will it sprout spectral wings of some nature and soar!?
It's like you missed half of what I wrote. Yes, microtransactions are in tons of games...but the thing is those games don't have subs either. Buy the game, pay for extras, nothing else.

I'm already paying for the mount even if I don't buy via my damn sub. That $15 is going toward things already that I then have to pay even more for.

And "not often" is virtually never. All those badass bat skins will never see the light of day as a mount amongst others.

I also said to put the snazzier ones in the store, like how the raid and pvp mounts are snaazzier than the regular ones, but there's still alternatives, even if they're more drab.

Also it's not "free" when you're paying monthly to play but still can't get access to everything. Champions Online had a nice way of doing it with a free-to-play model, a sub and a store. You could pick and choose what you wanted to pay for in a way.
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by cowmuflage » Wed Aug 12, 2015 10:20 pm

Store mounts are like "unique" pet skins to me. Just extra icing on the cake that I can get if I want too.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Lupen202 » Wed Aug 12, 2015 10:34 pm

I really wish we could get some simple moose mounts as well, no blue markings and no armor. But probably won't with the store mount even If the differences would be enough.

Personally, I'm still hoping for some ELK mounts as well. I think they'd make the perfect elf mounts (and not just because of Middle earth *cough*)

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Castile » Wed Aug 12, 2015 10:44 pm

Pepsi Jedi wrote: Well... part of getting the snazzy cool mount from the store, seems to be that yes, they're not 'as often' duplicated in the game. I.E. you get a little bit of exclusitivity for having paid for the snazzy mount.
This perfectly sums up how and why store mounts are..well the way they are. You are paying for a unique mount. Like we pay for a CE edition mount (except in the case of WoD ergh..) - your buying it to have something thats unique. If it was another wolf recolour or similuar no one would bother to buy it and that wouldn't make the overlords at Activision happy would it? :lol:

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Lisaara » Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:21 pm

Castile wrote:
Pepsi Jedi wrote: Well... part of getting the snazzy cool mount from the store, seems to be that yes, they're not 'as often' duplicated in the game. I.E. you get a little bit of exclusitivity for having paid for the snazzy mount.
This perfectly sums up how and why store mounts are..well the way they are. You are paying for a unique mount. Like we pay for a CE edition mount (except in the case of WoD ergh..) - your buying it to have something thats unique. If it was another wolf recolour or similuar no one would bother to buy it and that wouldn't make the overlords at Activision happy would it? :lol:
Sums it up for me too.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by SylviaDragon » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:01 am

I wouldn't mind them doing this if they don't fit with the current xpack themes, or if they allow other options for obtaining reskins. wod had a lot of store mounts that should have been obtained through reps and other in-game accomplishments but they chose to put those mounts in the store instead and i did NOT like how that affected things at all. instead of creative variety we got 12 boar reskins and 11 wolf reskins, or something close to that number.

why not add unarmored ones to the game and armored ones to the store? or give the store-bought ones the ability to fly while the others remain as ground mounts? I would be happy with a grounded, unarmored moose while store goers got to fly around on their armored spectral-winged moose. (kind of like how the headless horseman and kara mounts are so similar, yet different.)

yes, some players will opt to only get the in-game ones but they are already paying for the sub and the xpack so why not give them an alternative? you often see rep, pvp and pve alternative versions of mounts so everyone has a chance to get one. and the mount collectors would just have more things to chase after. people would still buy the fancy versions from the store.

also, i simply do not agree with the price tags on most store stuff. if it was ten bucks for a mount then i would treat myself now and then. but i don't personally approve of the 25, 30$ price tags. I know some people are chill with the cost but my opinion just differs.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Lisaara » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:04 am

SylviaDragon wrote:I wouldn't mind them doing this if they don't fit with the current xpack themes, or if they allow other options for obtaining reskins. wod had a lot of store mounts that should have been obtained through reps and other in-game accomplishments but they chose to put those mounts in the store instead and i did NOT like how that affected things at all. instead of creative variety we got 12 boar reskins and 11 wolf reskins, or something close to that number.

why not add unarmored ones to the game and armored ones to the store? or give the store-bought ones the ability to fly while the others remain as ground mounts? I would be happy with a grounded, unarmored moose while store goers got to fly around on their armored spectral-winged moose. (kind of like how the headless horseman and kara mounts are so similar, yet different.)

yes, some players will opt to only get the in-game ones but they are already paying for the sub and the xpack so why not give them an alternative? you often see rep, pvp and pve alternative versions of mounts so everyone has a chance to get one. and the mount collectors would just have more things to chase after. people would still buy the fancy versions from the store.

also, i simply do not agree with the price tags on most store stuff. if it was ten bucks for a mount then i would treat myself now and then. but i don't personally approve of the 25, 30$ price tags. I know some people are chill with the cost but my opinion just differs.
I do agree the prices are....anything but micro. I think mounts should be $10 or $15 and mini pets should be $5.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:25 am

MaximumOverdrive wrote:
Pepsi Jedi wrote:
MaximumOverdrive wrote:That's why I said put the fancier ones in the store, but leave other, maybe less or no armored ones, available in game. Having to spend an additional $255 plus the monthly subscription for mounts you literally cannot get anywhere else is bad. Even most of the raid and pvp mounts have alternatives that aren't as fancy to help compensate. And for the many mount completionists in game, they'll still buy it.

The price is a bit of another issue as well. $25, at the time, was fine cause they were the only BoA mounts. Now that all mounts are, the price is stupid (and hell more expensive with the mecha horse cause they put some stupid gimmick with it).

This is the only game that gets away with having a sub and store like this. And when they put more work into the store than in game, it's gunna come back to bite them.
It's really not. Microtransactions are found all over the place in video games now. Be it 'skins' or what have you. Look at Star Trek Online. from ships to crew to frigging uniforms can all be bought in the store.

This seems to point back up to one of my proposed guesses. "Some people want everything free in the game"

You don't want to have to "pay" for the mount you want, You want it, or a version of it in the game for free.

Well... part of getting the snazzy cool mount from the store, seems to be that yes, they're not 'as often' duplicated in the game. I.E. you get a little bit of exclusitivity for having paid for the snazzy mount.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Now my question is..... Will the Moose Fly? Will it sprout spectral wings of some nature and soar!?
It's like you missed half of what I wrote. Yes, microtransactions are in tons of games...but the thing is those games don't have subs either. Buy the game, pay for extras, nothing else.

I'm already paying for the mount even if I don't buy via my damn sub. That $15 is going toward things already that I then have to pay even more for.

And "not often" is virtually never. All those badass bat skins will never see the light of day as a mount amongst others.

I also said to put the snazzier ones in the store, like how the raid and pvp mounts are snaazzier than the regular ones, but there's still alternatives, even if they're more drab.

Also it's not "free" when you're paying monthly to play but still can't get access to everything. Champions Online had a nice way of doing it with a free-to-play model, a sub and a store. You could pick and choose what you wanted to pay for in a way.
No. You don't 'HAVE' to pay for it. You -want- it, so you weigh how much you want it, like any 'item' for any adult. If you want it enough to pay the price you pay the price and get the item. It gives you no in game advantage over any other mount. You don't get to run faster or fly faster or farther. It's a simple cosmetic thing for those that -wish to pay for it-.

Your post doesn't come right out and say it directly but yes, it implys that due to you paying a subscription, you want the mount available to you, -because- you pay the subscription. You feel entitled to it.

It's a 'special cosmetic item'. To use it, you pay the added one time fee. If you don't want to pay the fee, it won't affect your game. They've not put in store items that make you stronger than the hunter standing beside you. You don't buy a special bow or gun that makes your hunter better than the next hunter who hasn't paid for it. You don't buy new pets that the other hunters can't get, that have added powers.

It's a cosmetic thing. Buy it or not. That's up to you, but don't complain you're not getting the 'special' item with your standard subscription. It's a bonus thing, 'unneeded' but available.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:32 am

SylviaDragon wrote:I wouldn't mind them doing this if they don't fit with the current xpack themes, or if they allow other options for obtaining reskins. wod had a lot of store mounts that should have been obtained through reps and other in-game accomplishments but they chose to put those mounts in the store instead and i did NOT like how that affected things at all. instead of creative variety we got 12 boar reskins and 11 wolf reskins, or something close to that number.

why not add unarmored ones to the game and armored ones to the store? or give the store-bought ones the ability to fly while the others remain as ground mounts? I would be happy with a grounded, unarmored moose while store goers got to fly around on their armored spectral-winged moose. (kind of like how the headless horseman and kara mounts are so similar, yet different.)

yes, some players will opt to only get the in-game ones but they are already paying for the sub and the xpack so why not give them an alternative? you often see rep, pvp and pve alternative versions of mounts so everyone has a chance to get one. and the mount collectors would just have more things to chase after. people would still buy the fancy versions from the store.

also, i simply do not agree with the price tags on most store stuff. if it was ten bucks for a mount then i would treat myself now and then. but i don't personally approve of the 25, 30$ price tags. I know some people are chill with the cost but my opinion just differs.

I can't speak for blizzard, but I'm guessing that the answer to your query's is 'If there's 5 ways to get the mount in the game with out paying, noone's going to pay to get the 6th." or "Signifigantly fewer people would pay for a 6th recolor if they have 5 already"

That tendancy not to be often replicated in the game, is part of why store mounts sell. They're 'special', in that they're often unique.

As to why we got 7 wolves, wolves have been in wow from the first mounts, and fit the orc theme. The pigs. ugg. I could do with out. lol But I imagine we got so many reskins because it was easier to make 7 different wolves than 5 different wolves and 5 different reavers/bugs. In this fashion they made the wolves 'standard' (With a few exceptions. I can't get the green one and I hate that.) and the reaver, 'special'. Due to that, they put it in the store.

The question you ask 'they're already paying for the sub and xpac, why not give it to them" is akin to going

"I bought tickets for the football game in the nosebleed section, but someone paid for a private sky booth... why not give ME the access to the sky booth?!?!?!? I paid for my ticket!!

The people that chose to pay more, got more. In wow, if the people choose to pay $20 for a mount they get a snazzy mount. lol You're demanding to ALSO get the snazzy mount because you paid the basic fee.

The world doesn't really work like that. If it did, where would the point of paying more for the speical mount factor in? I mean if it was a color you just REALLY had to have (For me, the fel wolf mount. I'd buy that sucker in a heart beat) but past that, your store mount sales would go through the floor.

If you can get the ... Moose for example, in black, red, purple, green and white.... why would people pay $20 to get it in orange? Sure people that love orange would.. but the other people would go "I've got a black moose, red moose, purple moose, green moose and even an albino moose.. they can keep their damn orange one"

Instead they put (So far) one moose in as a store mount. Those that want moose mounts go "HOLY BALLS!! A MOOSE MOUNT! I MUST HAVE IT!" (( points up in the thread))

Blizzard -is- a business guys. They're -trying- to make money.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:36 am

Lets also remember. There's over 300 mounts in the game (or about to be)

Including the majestic magnificent mighty Moose, there's..... 11 store mounts.

You have 30 TIMES as many mounts that you can get in the game with out paying a dime.

The 11 store mounts hurt noone at all, if they -choose- not to pay for them.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Pepsi Jedi » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:38 am

Junrei wrote: I do agree the prices are....anything but micro. I think mounts should be $10 or $15 and mini pets should be $5.
I wish they were a bit cheaper.

They -were- worth more before all mounts were account wide, and you got the store mount for every char... but... the trade off with all your other mounts being account wide is worth it.

Store mounts are few and pretty well spaced out. They're not gonna bankrupt you if you want some of them.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Jurz » Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:57 am

Junrei wrote:
SylviaDragon wrote:I wouldn't mind them doing this if they don't fit with the current xpack themes, or if they allow other options for obtaining reskins. wod had a lot of store mounts that should have been obtained through reps and other in-game accomplishments but they chose to put those mounts in the store instead and i did NOT like how that affected things at all. instead of creative variety we got 12 boar reskins and 11 wolf reskins, or something close to that number.

why not add unarmored ones to the game and armored ones to the store? or give the store-bought ones the ability to fly while the others remain as ground mounts? I would be happy with a grounded, unarmored moose while store goers got to fly around on their armored spectral-winged moose. (kind of like how the headless horseman and kara mounts are so similar, yet different.)

yes, some players will opt to only get the in-game ones but they are already paying for the sub and the xpack so why not give them an alternative? you often see rep, pvp and pve alternative versions of mounts so everyone has a chance to get one. and the mount collectors would just have more things to chase after. people would still buy the fancy versions from the store.

also, i simply do not agree with the price tags on most store stuff. if it was ten bucks for a mount then i would treat myself now and then. but i don't personally approve of the 25, 30$ price tags. I know some people are chill with the cost but my opinion just differs.
I do agree the prices are....anything but micro. I think mounts should be $10 or $15 and mini pets should be $5.
I just wait until Christmas time when they're half off and only buy the mounts I really like haha I'm a mount collector, but I can't justify $12.5 even unless it's one I really like. I agree though, most games either have a sub or a shop, having both is just plain greedy in my opinion :/ I feel like subs+xpacs are enough, but maybe that's because I'm in college and getting a sub is hard enough on its own.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Wain » Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:50 am

I know a store mount is an unjustifiable luxury for some people, especially if you're a student or out of work. :( I know it's of little consolation when you're in that position but as Pepsi Jedi pointed out at least Store mounts represent a very tiny proportion of total mounts. And we do have some really awesome mounts available in game. In fact the upcoming Azure Celestial Cloud Serpent is probably the one I love more than any other and that's a collection achievement mount. I'm so looking forward to it!
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Wain » Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:53 am

Having said that, if it had been me allocating the next store mount, I probably wouldn't have chosen the moose. It developed such a player-based (and player-originated) mythology behind it that feels to me like something that should become more readily available. But ah well.
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Qraljar » Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:56 am

Wain wrote:I know a store mount is an unjustifiable luxury for some people, especially if you're a student or out of work. :( I know it's of little consolation when you're in that position but as Pepsi Jedi pointed out at least Store mounts represent a very tiny proportion of total mounts. And we do have some really awesome mounts available in game. In fact the upcoming Azure Celestial Cloud Serpent is probably the one I love more than any other and that's a collection achievement mount. I'm so looking forward to it!
I don't think it's really acceptable in some cases. Like in WoD, where it was Boarlords of GoToTheShopnor. Sorry, but you can't add unique mounts to the shop and then give players the umpteenth boar recolour, especially when the boar animations have only been given a bandaid fix since 6.0.

If you can't give players a vast variety of mounts in the game, you don't deserve to make an extra buck off putting unique mounts in the shop.

First you finish your plate (create unique and interesting mounts for players to get ingame) and then you have dessert (put mounts on the store for extra money), that's simply how it should be. Else I'd be playing a F2P game.
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Mindsprocket » Thu Aug 13, 2015 4:07 am

Qraljar wrote:I don't think it's really acceptable in some cases. Like in WoD, where it was Boarlords of GoToTheShopnor. Sorry, but you can't add unique mounts to the shop and then give players the umpteenth boar recolour, especially when the boar animations have only been given a bandaid fix since 6.0.
I agree. Reducing the variety of mounts in game to have more to offer in the store is not ok. The store mounts started out as models that were truly unique, with nothing like it in the game - the Celestial Steed, Winged Guradian, Heart of the Aspects, Windsteed, etc. (though in the case of the last one I'm a little disappointed that we probably won't get the other colours, which you can see here on MMO-Champion - love the red one!).

But mounts like bats, rylaks, ravagers and now the moose are normal creatures in game. They aren't actually special enough to warrant being in the store. They should absolutely be available in the game, different colours from different sources (rep, raid drops, etc.). At least now there is the Soaring Skyterror as an unarmored different-colour version of the Iron Skyreaver, so hopefully that means Blizzard will do the same thing for the others.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Lisaara » Thu Aug 13, 2015 4:27 am

Jurz wrote:
Junrei wrote:
SylviaDragon wrote:I wouldn't mind them doing this if they don't fit with the current xpack themes, or if they allow other options for obtaining reskins. wod had a lot of store mounts that should have been obtained through reps and other in-game accomplishments but they chose to put those mounts in the store instead and i did NOT like how that affected things at all. instead of creative variety we got 12 boar reskins and 11 wolf reskins, or something close to that number.

why not add unarmored ones to the game and armored ones to the store? or give the store-bought ones the ability to fly while the others remain as ground mounts? I would be happy with a grounded, unarmored moose while store goers got to fly around on their armored spectral-winged moose. (kind of like how the headless horseman and kara mounts are so similar, yet different.)

yes, some players will opt to only get the in-game ones but they are already paying for the sub and the xpack so why not give them an alternative? you often see rep, pvp and pve alternative versions of mounts so everyone has a chance to get one. and the mount collectors would just have more things to chase after. people would still buy the fancy versions from the store.

also, i simply do not agree with the price tags on most store stuff. if it was ten bucks for a mount then i would treat myself now and then. but i don't personally approve of the 25, 30$ price tags. I know some people are chill with the cost but my opinion just differs.
I do agree the prices are....anything but micro. I think mounts should be $10 or $15 and mini pets should be $5.
I just wait until Christmas time when they're half off and only buy the mounts I really like haha I'm a mount collector, but I can't justify $12.5 even unless it's one I really like. I agree though, most games either have a sub or a shop, having both is just plain greedy in my opinion :/ I feel like subs+xpacs are enough, but maybe that's because I'm in college and getting a sub is hard enough on its own.
Actually, many other mmos I've played have both these days. Example: SWTOR. It has a subscription(which you can play for free, but you're severely punished if you dont sub) and they have the 'Cartel Shop' which is....worse than the Blizzstore. I think that's why I get baffled when people complain so much about the Blizz Store. The Cartel Shop has SO MANY MORE things locked away like hairstyles, hair color, lightsaber crystals(that do have stats and are super rare, btw), armor sets, even playable races...all locked behind cartel coins....also SWTOR has over 100 mounts in their shop that most you can only get by CHANCE via one of their packs.....and it's a really rare chance at that. Most times you'll get a rep boost, a couple pieces of armor, and exp boosts for various stuff.

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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Wain » Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:10 am

I would LOVE to see them add a greater variety of mount models to standard gameplay. I admit the variety was a bit lower and more disappointing this time, but it wasn't all boar mounts. The sheer number of boar mounts was due to the number of colours the art team created for the world. The designers just did their best to ensure they were all available somewhere, for whomever wanted them, but if they hadn't been put in it's not like they would have used other mounts. They just wouldn't have added anything at all. I repeat that I would have liked a greater variety too, but this focus on boar mounts, as if that's all we got, is a narrow argument I think.

As for the Store, I don't mind how many they add. While I love to collect mounts, it's not a mount-collection game and they don't promise a certain number with your subscription that you are guaranteed to find attractive. I'd be sorely disappointed if there were fewer mounts added to the game, but unless the game promotion promises a certain number (it doesn't) none of us are owed any particular amount with our game subs.
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Quiv » Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:56 am

Lupen202 wrote:I really wish we could get some simple moose mounts as well, no blue markings and no armor. But probably won't with the store mount even If the differences would be enough.
Well consider that in-game variants of the WoD CE mount (dread raven) and store mount (rylak) have made it in, I don't think its impossible!
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Re: New mounts

Unread post by Shade » Thu Aug 13, 2015 9:25 am

I love buying store mounts personally-the detail to them is great.

I can see why people can be mad about them not being some kind of achievement mount in game instead-but then some of the coolest achievement mounts are ridiculously hard to get. Invincible? I seriously want that but its been a very long time since it was released and I have yet to manage it-though I admit I rarely try anymore given that I have just all but given up on the RNG. Rivendare's Deathcharger still has not made it way to me either-and I will not admit to how many times I've ground that instance for that danged thing. It is nice to have a snazzy mount that I am guaranteed, rather than waiting for a RNG drop (and nice to have an additional mount towards my achievement count). I do not mind paying for something like that as it is (mostly with the mount collection achieves) cosmetic. Also I see cosmetic gear, mounts and other things sold in the FF14 store, and I do not seem to hear nearly as much complaining in that game about it. Confusing.

Anyways.

Looking at the Blizzard post:
That felhound mount and companion pet are the collectors edition I figure-will certainly be picking that up, as I have for all of the editions since WOTLK.
The little purple kitten companion pet-I adore my store mount of this, that kitten will be MINE!
Betting the Murky-Illidan pet will be Blizzcon like the paladin and firey one before?
No idea what the ghosty thing is

I want the moose, just take my money Blizz


Looking at the warcraft mounts page: http://www.warcraftmounts.com/

I want that danged blue celestial dragon (even though flight seems all but obsolete lately). I've not made it to the 200, much less 250 mount achievement yet though, so it'll be awhile :(

Timewalking mounts look really interesting, I wonder how that is going to pan out concept wise.

And it looks like there is a new Christmas holiday mount coming this year?

Pretty happy so far with what they have shown us. :)

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