Flying in WoD

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Lisaara
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Lisaara »

Castile wrote:The arguement "I paid real money for those mounts" is kinda flawed as well. All those store mounts work both as ground and flying mounts currently - nothing will stop you from using them. And as Veph pointed out ALL mounts will work as ground mounts anyway. No ones making you abandon them.

If anything it will make you use currently ignored mounts that you worked even harder for (ground mounts) and I can't see that as being a bad thing at all.
I'm with this here. And no, it's not insulting. I love having my dragon walk. I think it's cute. Let's not try to turn something subjective into a fact. Subjective things are opinions.

Fact: Flying mounts(most of them) can be mounted on the ground. Even the ones you paid for.
Opinion/Subjective: This is insulting, they look silly/goofy/cute while walking on the ground!

I also agree with a post above that if you want change, complaining here will do nothing. If you want to make a difference, it's better off being said on the official forums in a mature fashion. :) But if you don't want to contribute to one way or the other and just wanna vent, then doing do here is fine too.

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by pop »

This is just gating because they have no idea how to encourage ground mount while at the same time allowing flying by actually giving actually incentive for us not to fly, nothing more and nothing less.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Xella »

I don't like the lack of flying and I think I've said as much and can't really contribute much more on that topic, BUT.

On the topic of flying mounts being usable in no-fly zones: I'm not really okay with this, because a lot of flying mounts are REALLY REALLY BIG. Like, mammoth big. When you're up in the air it doesn't matter as much because you're rarely interacting with NPCs but when you're down on the ground it's super easy for people to cover up the relevant NPCs. "shift+v" is the usual bypass and you can always report people you feel are deliberately abusing the size of their mounts (for all the good that doesn't seem to do, Ironforge went CRZ-free partway through Winter's Veil because people were just abusing it and since they weren't necessarily on your server like they were for Horde you couldn't just ostracize them and expect it to do any good) but it doesn't take much to forget to approach a group of NPCs head-on on a drake and have the extra length of your body (or your proto-drake's wings) clip the other NPCs and make it much more difficult for other players to interact with the quest givers. Even the invisible bounding boxes they (eventually) put on the NPCs for the Pandaria intro quests and on the t16 vendors in the shrines won't stop a dragon's butt from getting in the way, because the dragon's hitbox is not equivalent to their model and it's the collision of hitbox with hitbox that prevents you from standing on top of those NPCs).

Blizzard isn't going to completely redesign those mounts for a world where your dragons' wings are clipped. They may increase the hitbox but I doubt it (for technical and pvp reasons). Flying mounts on the ground are a recipe for frustration, both for the people who like their flying mounts to fly, and for the people who like interacting with NPCs by actually interacting with NPCs and not their nameplates (especially since there are a lot of things you can't DO with nameplates, like steal the flame out of the Wandering Isle starting guy's hand. Imagine if someone designed a quest like that in an area where you could be mounted!).

I understand WHY they're doing it—in Pandaria, if your favourite epeen mount is a ground mount you could get on it in shrine even if it wasn't practical for navigating the landscape, but on Draenor, the reverse wouldn't necessarily be true—but I don't think it will end well, I don't think the devs can account for every potential griefer, and they've said multiple times that the WoD beta test will be smaller than Mists so there's no guarantee the people who actually care to make sure griefers don't HAVE those avenues easily-accessible will even get into the tests to report any accidental oversights.

Then again, there's never really a guarantee that the people who would provide meaningful feedback and bug reports get into the beta, nor that their feedback actually gets presented in a useful way or heard if it does, so :\

I'm just still really super bitter about /bug crashing the mac client for the entirety of the Elder Scrolls Online beta weekends, and them not having any other way to report errors or offer suggestions outside of shouting into the void via twitter, thus ensuring that the bugs that I tried to report were still gamebreaking and active when they went live.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Slickrock »

I'd like to see some discussion regarding flying apart from the mounts issue.

One thing for certain, they need to fix the flightpaths...
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Rawr »

I'm still not sure why there is an argument about this, Blizz does this every expansion so it's not like it's a surprise or anything. :| :mrgreen:

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by AdamSavage »

Slickrock wrote:I'd like to see some discussion regarding flying apart from the mounts issue.

One thing for certain, they need to fix the flightpaths...
That's one thing they need to fix for sure.. Having a system like they do in Timeless Isle, where you can pick up stuff that makes you move faster. They could even put a buff on the ground mounts that makes them move 50% faster or something.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by pop »

Rawr wrote:I'm still not sure why there is an argument about this, Blizz does this every expansion so it's not like it's a surprise or anything. :| :mrgreen:
Which expansion that they decided to remove flying altogether on all of the expansion content or at least until a major patch besides WOD, pray tell?
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Castile »

pop wrote:
Rawr wrote:I'm still not sure why there is an argument about this, Blizz does this every expansion so it's not like it's a surprise or anything. :| :mrgreen:
Which expansion that they decided to remove flying altogether on all of the expansion content or at least until a major patch besides WOD, pray tell?
They haven't confirmed they are removing it altogether so thats just speculation. The only thing thats confirmed is the major patch and really that isn't too far after the majority of ppl hit 100.

In the words of the pandarian "slow down". They want people to explore and actually do the quests rather than have 5 people race for realm firsts (which have also been removed) then have those people swoop in and flood the ah with resources only they can get. The flight paths have already been a confirmed improvement for the time between the patch so it's not going to be a massive drag to not fly for awhile. Its a wait and see thing atm anyway until blizzcon/beta reveals more.

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Nachtwulf »

They've also said specifically that they're going to make the flight paths in WoD be less of a 'scenic tour' and more direct point-a to point-b. And that their testers are SPECIFICALLY looking for weirdnesses in the paths.

Meanwhile in Northrend there's still an Alliance FP that goes right through a tree.
It's not even a small tree. It's a giant flowering behemoth in Dragonblight and you go 'foop' right through the middle of it. I always imagine my character coming out the other side spitting flower petals and covered in branches.

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Lisaara »

Nachtwulf wrote:They've also said specifically that they're going to make the flight paths in WoD be less of a 'scenic tour' and more direct point-a to point-b. And that their testers are SPECIFICALLY looking for weirdnesses in the paths.

Meanwhile in Northrend there's still an Alliance FP that goes right through a tree.
It's not even a small tree. It's a giant flowering behemoth in Dragonblight and you go 'foop' right through the middle of it. I always imagine my character coming out the other side spitting flower petals and covered in branches.
God I remember that one. I was like "How the hell....WAT?!"

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Sukurachi »

While they're at it, why don't they fix old world flight paths too?
I hate having to fly around Thunderbluff 5 times before landing. It reminds me of my old dog when she'd lie down... round and round and round and round and PLOP.

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by AdamSavage »

Nachtwulf wrote:They've also said specifically that they're going to make the flight paths in WoD be less of a 'scenic tour' and more direct point-a to point-b. And that their testers are SPECIFICALLY looking for weirdnesses in the paths.


It's not that hard to check for wierdnessses in the flight paths, and I will believe it when it I see it. I think MOP was the closest they got to proper flight paths, with the exception of a couple weird ones.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Rawr »

pop wrote:
Rawr wrote:I'm still not sure why there is an argument about this, Blizz does this every expansion so it's not like it's a surprise or anything. :| :mrgreen:
Which expansion that they decided to remove flying altogether on all of the expansion content or at least until a major patch besides WOD, pray tell?
I'd like a link from a blue post saying they are getting rid flying altogether please :| . Last I heard they were not allowing flying till max level, like every expansion ever. :mrgreen:

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by AdamSavage »

Rawr wrote:I'd like a link from a blue post saying they are getting rid flying altogether please :| . Last I heard they were not allowing flying till max level, like every expansion ever. :mrgreen:
Last I heard, it was still the first patch and they are not sure if it will be for the entire expansion.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Lisaara »

Sukurachi wrote:While they're at it, why don't they fix old world flight paths too?
I hate having to fly around Thunderbluff 5 times before landing. It reminds me of my old dog when she'd lie down... round and round and round and round and PLOP.
I'd love for them to fix the freakin old world ones. ><;

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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Danielfboone »

Castile wrote:
pop wrote:
Rawr wrote:I'm still not sure why there is an argument about this, Blizz does this every expansion so it's not like it's a surprise or anything. :| :mrgreen:
Which expansion that they decided to remove flying altogether on all of the expansion content or at least until a major patch besides WOD, pray tell?
They haven't confirmed they are removing it altogether so thats just speculation. The only thing thats confirmed is the major patch and really that isn't too far after the majority of ppl hit 100.

In the words of the pandarian "slow down". They want people to explore and actually do the quests rather than have 5 people race for realm firsts (which have also been removed) then have those people swoop in and flood the ah with resources only they can get. The flight paths have already been a confirmed improvement for the time between the patch so it's not going to be a massive drag to not fly for awhile. Its a wait and see thing atm anyway until blizzcon/beta reveals more.
Hopefully, it's released before Blizzcon!
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Slickrock »

I'm betting that we'll see 6.0 before Blizzcon, and WoD after.

If not, I may sell my Blizzcon ticket, not much to see or hear at Blizzcon if the expac is released a few weeks before.. and that would seriously crimp leveling...
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Xota »

Junrei wrote: ...
Also your post makes me feel this needs to be emphasized due to how general the blanket was: They're mot removing flying completely. Only Draenor(for now). No where else. This isn't a rumor. This is confirmed information that's been on MMOChampion a dozen times over.
...
I'm not sure why people keep bringing this up. I don't think it's that relevant to other's concerns about being grounded. People who are concerned about being grounded are concerned about being grounded on Draenor. It feels dismissive.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Slickrock »

I would still go back to the issue that no-flying is related in part to the devs wanting to deploy TI type content across Dreanor, which flying would trivialize.

The only real solution to keep flying in that case is then to turn off the detection of that type of content when on a flying mount. Which would probably cause more problems than it would solve.
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Re: Flying in WoD

Unread post by Xota »

Slickrock wrote:I would still go back to the issue that no-flying is related in part to the devs wanting to deploy TI type content across Dreanor, which flying would trivialize.

The only real solution to keep flying in that case is then to turn off the detection of that type of content when on a flying mount. Which would probably cause more problems than it would solve.
That may indeed be part of it, but I disagree that it would cause more problems than it would solve. For example, on TI right now Cinderfall is not detectable from below. Secondly, even TI-type content becomes "obsolete". Several patches into WoD, when the 'current' content is some contained area, there's much less reason to keep people grounded for year old TI-type content. Finally, TI isn't entirely non-flying. Without gliders, TI would be even more tedious than it already is. When you scale that kind of content up from a relatively small zone to a continent, I expect glider type mechanics to feel more gimmicky and less effective.

However, the official stated reason, I've seen is that they want to be able to add patch content where we're grounded without putting it on a magical island. Which shouldn't require grounding the entire continent, just some sub-zones.
Rawr wrote:
pop wrote:
Rawr wrote:I'm still not sure why there is an argument about this, Blizz does this every expansion so it's not like it's a surprise or anything. :| :mrgreen:
Which expansion that they decided to remove flying altogether on all of the expansion content or at least until a major patch besides WOD, pray tell?
I'd like a link from a blue post saying they are getting rid flying altogether please :| . Last I heard they were not allowing flying till max level, like every expansion ever. :mrgreen:
Bashiok wrote: In Draenor we’re designing max-level content, portions of zones or zones in their entirety that will be dedicated to max-level gameplay—and not just the top of a cliffside, or some dailies in the Vale. There’s a harsh change in how the game plays between leveling, and when you hit max level. Hitting 100 and instantly switching everything you do to raiding or Arenas is pretty abrupt, and we want to try to keep that questing experience available at max level with something more robust than daily quests. We don’t think having all of that content inside buildings, or constantly challenged by sky cannons, or with magical no-flying smoke, or within some kind of dismount bubble is the most straightforward or best solution to the ultimate issue in that World of Warcraft is not a flight sim, and that's just not what the content of the game is about. Even at level 100 there will be no small portions of the game world intended to provide relevant content even to max-level players. These zones may even unlock over the course of the expansion, or the content in them will progress in story and scope throughout content patches. Content has to be designed with the expectation that there either is or is not flight, and approaching ground-level content from the ground offers more compelling gameplay. Raids, dungeons, and PvP continue to disallow flying for this same reason.
Whether or not you interpret that as "we don't want flying the whole expansion" or not, that's how many people understand it. And that's why we're discouraged. I don't get why the scalpel of 'dismount bubbles' is not a better solution than the sledge-hammer of perma-grounding a whole continent. I guess I have to wait and see, since there's no explanation forthcoming. If I don't lose interest by the time it comes out... that's the problem with the uncertainty of 'wait and see'.
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