Legion - random ideas thread

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Wain
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Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Wain » Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:53 pm

This is just a place to centralize random ideas.

Everyone has their own ideas on things they think should be included in Legion. Some of these ideas are pertinent to existing topics and would be posted on those threads. Others may big or developed enough to warrant having their own threads. For anything else, feel free to post your ideas or random thoughts here. Even if you want to create your own thread for your idea, you can still post a reference link here if you like :)
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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Xota » Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:23 pm

If Bestial Wrath is going to have large uptime, then the models shouldn't be filtered red. It doesn't look good on many of them. Maybe some sort of cloud around them, instead.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Lupen202 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:42 pm

I think it'd be cool if our pets eyes just glowed red during bestial wrath, maybe increasing in size as well like they do now.

I agree though that the whole pet turning red is kind of an ugly effect.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Vephriel » Mon Nov 09, 2015 5:30 pm

That's a good idea actually! With all the new effects they've come up with by now, the original BW one is pretty...lackluster. I'm sure they could do something much cooler looking and still retain that sort of bloodthirsty, frenzied feel.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Bristlenose » Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:56 pm

Almost as much a question as an idea since I have not seen anything either way, what about Survival getting the use of exotic pets? With MM having no pets and Survival going melee, would it hurt to allow them exotics? I used to prefer Survival but went to Beast Mastery after exotics came out. I like spirit beasts too much and it's nice to have a corehoundquilen battle rez in a pinch if you have no druids. (Corehounds have timewarp, not brez. :oops: )

In fact way, way back in BC when I first started playing I melee'd with my hunter initially because I had no idea what I was doing. And we had the use of melee weapons too, further confusing me. :lol:

Now it has come full circle and I will probably respec at least one of my hunters to Survival and probably another to Marksman. And leave the third one Beast Mastery.
Last edited by Bristlenose on Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by zedxrgal » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:19 pm

Gnome hunters!!!! *ducks for cover*

The could have a frog as the starting pet! Would be epic! :twisted:

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Wain » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:28 pm

Xota wrote:If Bestial Wrath is going to have large uptime, then the models shouldn't be filtered red. It doesn't look good on many of them. Maybe some sort of cloud around them, instead.
Good thought! The red thing is fun if it's only once in a while, but it will look pretty off if we and our pets are going to be like that constantly.
Bristlenose wrote:Almost as much a question as an idea since I have not seen anything either way, what about Survival getting the use of exotic pets? With MM having no pets and Survival going melee, would it hurt to allow them exotics?
Agreed. I think the exotic category is no longer as relevant as it once was and we'd be better off removing it. I thought that before these changes were announced (and I know others did too, there's a discussion somewhere), but the announcements only reinforce my belief.
zedxrgal wrote:Gnome hunters!!!! *ducks for cover*
The could have a frog as the starting pet! Would be epic! :twisted:
The call for gnome hunters seems to be everywhere :) They're best friends with the dwarves, they MUST have picked up the skill :)

The frog would be cute, though it would have to be a cyber frog with a radio collar. ;)
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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Bristlenose » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:54 pm

I also think frog pets would be a nice addition. I remember several years ago pre-Pandaria I think where it was brought up but so far nothing has come of it.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Equeon » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:11 am

Bristlenose wrote:Almost as much a question as an idea since I have not seen anything either way, what about Survival getting the use of exotic pets? With MM having no pets and Survival going melee, would it hurt to allow them exotics? I used to prefer Survival but went to Beast Mastery after exotics came out. I like spirit beasts too much and it's nice to have a corehound battle rez in a pinch of you have no druids.
Wain wrote:Agreed. I think the exotic category is no longer as relevant as it once was and we'd be better off removing it. I thought that before these changes were announced (and I know others did too, there's a discussion somewhere), but the announcements only reinforce my belief.
With all due respect, I completely disagree. This expansion is supposed to be all about increasing class fantasy while decreasing spec homogeneity, and allowing survival to tame exotic beasts would achieve the opposite of both of those goals.

Exotic beasts work best for Beastmasters because, as Blizzard has said, they are the pet class. No other hunter could hope to tame tyrannosaurs or beings made of elemental rock... only the beastmasters' invigoration from the primal world's "dangerous and untamed nature" and their close bond with animals allows them to accomplish such feats.
In contrast, Survival hunters have pets to aid them in their hunting and trapping. Though they also share a close bond with their companion, it is one forged through a shared struggle for survival, not necessarily being in tune with the beast's nature or from a desire to tame challenging new creatures. It makes much more sense thematically for a ranger placing traps in the woods to be accompanied by a wolf or cat rather than the ghost of an ancient porcupine or a tentacled fen strider.

The only real argument I have seen for exotics being made available to all is that many pets that physically appear "exotic" are, in fact, tamable by all specs. For example, the lava spiders or the crackling worgs are just as, if not more, shiny than some of BM's exotics.

However, I feel that once again, the changes Legion brings will make this point less important. To start with, these pets were made available to all because Blizzard didn't usually want to spend a lot of time creating something special (direhorns or the lava spider challenges) for only a percentage of one class to be able to use them. Players would - and do - complain that "BM gets all the cool pets", and the fact that the debate over exotic availability is still going further proves this point.

Yet Legion's hunter changes means that Marksman will no longer have a pet at all - that's one less spec that could tame exotics anyway. Many shared abilities between the three specs are gone, and Blizzard is firm in its decision to make each spec feel properly varied to deliver on the "class fantasy." Differentiating specs is important enough in this expansion for each one to get its own artifact and storyline - that's 36 different stories for the sake of adding variety. With this new mentality, adding more unique BM tames like Gara would not be felt as a loss by the other specs, since they would presumably have their own exclusive aspects. It's the perfect time to add even more unique aspects to BM and survival alike. And with triple specialization becoming available, with just a few seconds of cast time you can have your exotic pets back by your side, no matter your preferred spec.


Leaving exotics to BM and melee and traps to Survival properly separates those hunters with a "profound bond with the creatures of the wild" from those who prefer to fight "facing one’s enemy eye-to-eye, accompanied by merciless bloodshed... laying deceptive traps to see their enemies undone."

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Xota » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:52 am

I agree with Equeon. A pet with that extra oomph buff/utility wise is kind of BM's niche. And remember, even if survival can't battle rez with a quillen or time warp with a core hound, moths and cranes can battle rez and nether rays can time warp. (and scorpids mortal wound, like Devilsaurs)

More ideas:
  • Caltrops as a trap for survival hunter. Like the hunters in Iron Docks use.
  • Survival hunter auto-attack turns into throw when out of melee range. Axes or spears.
transmogrification ideas (not necessarily hunter related):
  • Open up some more models/skins from white gear (eg: pandaren starting weapons)
  • Mobs in Legion should still drop weapons, models from whatever the npc's use (I doubt they'll be equipped with our artifacts).
  • Demonology Felguard weapon glyph change: It becomes a useable spell, letting you pick 1-2 weapons from your transmog collection, instead of picking random weapons from any of your bags. I miss being able to give him a pickax when I go out mining (like you could do in MoP).

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Wain » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:38 am

Regarding exotics, the idea was that (i) for the last few expansions what they choose to be exotic is kind of arbitrary compared to what they don't; a lot of new families and looks appear "exotic", but (ii) BMs should definitely get more out of their pet, but that could be applied to any pet family. They should be the only class to get a bonus power, like heroism or resurrection on their pet, but perhaps that could be extended to them getting a bonus skill out of any family they choose to run with, not just the ones currently classed as exotic.
  • Open up some more models/skins from white gear (eg: pandaren starting weapons)
  • Mobs in Legion should still drop weapons, models from whatever the npc's use (I doubt they'll be equipped with our artifacts).
I would love both these things. There surely must be new weapon art for NPCs, so it would be brilliant if we could get access to the looks from drops, even if they're just green drops.
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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Lupen202 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:44 am

I really do hope we get some weapon drops like Xota mentioned. The weapons could be purely cosmetic, and would drop from a variety of different sources. Some would be world drops, some would drop from specific rares, some would be rep or quest rewards...

I just think that it'd be a real shame to miss out on new looks completely where weapons are concerned (aside from the artifacts ofc), especially in an expansion with such gorgeous art. Night elves, Vrykul, Naga, demons, etc. ... would love to see weapons with all of those themes!
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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Equeon » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:51 am

Wain wrote: would love both these things. There surely must be new weapon art for NPCs, so it would be brilliant if we could get access to the looks from drops, even if they're just green drops.
Agreed. Especially since we won't be using our artifacts forever:
You won't be using Artifacts forever, maybe display them on your mantle in a future expansion.
It would be very awkward to have an entire expansion devoid of possible weapon transmogs.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Vephriel » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:52 am

Yeah, to go an entire expansion without any new weapon looks would be very sad. :( Especially once we're in future expansions, there'll just be this gap.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by SpiritBinder » Tue Nov 10, 2015 6:22 am

The Beastial Wrath thing at the top, I've been thinking about this too lately, I was originally thinking as a minor glyph, but having this visual...

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... which was a tech they introduced in MOP, I thought would be much more impactful as a visual :)

They seem to be using this effect for nearly all new "All over" effects. Shaman "Spirit wolves/raptors", trinkets like Rime of the Time-Lost Mariner
and the Fire-Watcher's Oath, Monks "Earth, Fire and Wind", etc. so I cant see it being too hard to add to the Hunter and Pet during BW

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by SpiritBinder » Tue Nov 10, 2015 6:32 am

Vephriel wrote:Yeah, to go an entire expansion without any new weapon looks would be very sad. :( Especially once we're in future expansions, they'll just be this gap.
I was wondering if this new "Must pick from looks from x-y-z artifacts" could be eased if they added some Cosmetic weapon looks to they game? They'd have to follow the same rules for transmog (so Frost DKs that are forced to use the duel wielding artifacts, will still have to stick to 1 handers) but if blizzard added some for achievements, or rare drops, or rewards from the final raid boss of a tier, etc.

I do like the idea of these artifacts, but certain weapon types being forced onto you, and the fact that there will be no available artwork for other variants is a bit :|

Hell they could even add some cosmetic weapons to the cash shop for all I care (though I know most of the world would RAGE :lol: ) I'd just like a few more options within the weapon uses.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Bristlenose » Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:24 pm

I think Wain's compromise is a good idea. Take away exotic pet looks but give every pet family an exotic ability exclusive to Beast Mastery. That way it doesn't take away the core ability of the pets but gives Survival hunters the option of some exotic looks which as Wain pointed out are somewhat arbitrary. They already have given pets buffs, giving Beast Mastery pets a bonus buff is an extension of that.

Also right there on giving us more weapon transmog options. As it stands right now you have to unlock the various transmogs for your weapon but once we move onto the next expansion we'll be either lacking a lot of options or have to grind out the particular transmog we want or redo the whole thing for an alt spec. Warriors want an axe or mace instead of a sword? Won't be from Legion. At least hunters have an option between a gun or bow, provided they do the work on a second spec.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Wain » Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:55 pm

The following isn't a hunter related idea at all, but more related to Druids and the Dream:

Currently every animated/intelligent/semi-intelligent plant NPC is classed as elemental, which seems like an arbitrary place to stick them, presumably because nothing else fits. They're organic creatures, not elementals. Even if you try to think of them as "life elementals" they're really no more so than animals are.

What I'd like to see is a new class of plant creatures to cover the huge array of models, from fly traps and savage orchids to vegetable hydras to grove wardens and ancients. Then give Druids an affinity for them / some degree of interaction or control over them. Not necessarily go and tame one like a hunter would an animal (though it would be cool!) but maybe at least a summons or temporary control. Druids should be able to summon angry flowers and trees into combat (or maybe they already do and I missed it).

Anyway, just something I thought might have found its right time, given that this expansion introduces the dream and goes back to the roots of Druidism.
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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Bristlenose » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:53 pm

I'm still iterating on this trying to find a good balance of practicality versus abusability.

A new exotic ability exclusive to Beast Mastery that allows your pet to resurrect you if you die much like the Shaman's self-resurrection. Call it "Undying Loyalty" for example since it ties into the close bond Beast Mastery hunters have with their pets. 20 minute cooldown, restores 33% health and maybe shares a cooldown/limitation with the battle rez from Quilen or other similar resurrections. That way it won't be so prone to abuse but also won't be entirely useless in raids and could free up a battle rez during boss fights. It is pinching a bit from Shaman but theirs is more powerful and not reliant on a pet to bring them back.

Probably won't happen but I think it fits good with Beast Mastery's devotion theme.
Wain wrote:The following isn't a hunter related idea at all, but more related to Druids and the Dream:

Currently every animated/intelligent/semi-intelligent plant NPC is classed as elemental, which seems like an arbitrary place to stick them, presumably because nothing else fits. They're organic creatures, not elementals. Even if you try to think of them as "life elementals" they're really no more so than animals are.

What I'd like to see is a new class of plant creatures to cover the huge array of models, from fly traps and savage orchids to vegetable hydras to grove wardens and ancients. Then give Druids an affinity for them / some degree of interaction or control over them. Not necessarily go and tame one like a hunter would an animal (though it would be cool!) but maybe at least a summons or temporary control. Druids should be able to summon angry flowers and trees into combat (or maybe they already do and I missed it).

Anyway, just something I thought might have found its right time, given that this expansion introduces the dream and goes back to the roots of Druidism.
As of right now they kind of have this with Treants (Force of Nature) but it is not a powerful talent to spec into. I think a new class like they did with aberrations could work though.

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Re: Legion - random ideas thread

Unread post by Lupen202 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 10:38 pm

You know, another thing that could differentiate BM from Surv if they give exotics to both specs, is simply allowing BM hunters to pick the buff their pet brings. Many of us have been asking for this for awhile, and I think it would be a nice skill for the spec to have. Maybe even as a talent.

Exotic and bonus abilities could not be changed of course, but their family ability could be. For example, you could have a spirit beast that can heal and buff multistrike instead of mastery.


Also, it'd be cool if there was a Beast mastery only glyph that worked similar to the glyph of lesser proportions - only instead it's a glyph of greater proportions. Seeing as beast masters are able to tame the largest and most powerful beasts, I think it'd be fitting that they'd be able to have (slightly) larger pets. Just a fun cosmetic option. :)
Last edited by Lupen202 on Wed Nov 11, 2015 1:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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