Blood Beast taming search

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Vephriel
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Vephriel » Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:45 pm

Wain wrote:Can anyone think of a logical thought process that would lead us to try an all-hunter raid? I can't remember any clue to trying it, nor any form of reason that would lead us to the conclusion of trying it. Was this just one of those "try random shit" puzzles suited to larger groups like the WoW Secrets community? If so I'm concerned.
I know the idea that came up the most was "maybe we have to solo Zul" which was....quite frankly ridiculous while this was current content, but that would be more in-tune with previous hunter challenges. We've never really had something that involved a large amount of hunters working together like this. I suppose it's in the same vein as the Hivemind - how it ended up encouraging teamwork, only I don't see how we could have thought of such a specific criteria on the bare amount of hints we were given.
Last edited by Vephriel on Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by GormanGhaste » Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:46 pm

Nope, I'll tame a blood tick a couple of expansions from now if I'm still playing.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Paradise Woods » Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:48 pm

Having it as a drop from an instanced raid boss at all is obnoxious, but they could have at least tried to limit the alienation by allowing it in LFR.

I'm not going to be grateful for them "being kind enough to allow it to drop in normal", or think "Well, it could be worse!" when there were 5000 other, better ways to have it drop, especially when they make it sound like they're doing us a favour. They slapped it on a PTR vendor so we couldn't test how/where to get it, gave no valuable hints and ??? somehow ??? expected us to decide "Well we haven't tried getting a max group of hunters to brute force heroic Zul, let's try that!" ???, watched hunters from every aspect of the game struggle to find something so obscure, then made sure that, of all those hunters, only the ones that play this way are rewarded.

I am happy that there are hunters who can get their crawgs, but I'm not gonna pretend like I appreciate their merciful change of heart or whatever. (This animosity is aimed at the situation, not any one person here!)

Re: pugging - This is all assuming groups will take the hunter in question, or that the hunter in question can fill a group they make themselves. I'm guessing LFG is absolutely flooded with hunters. It's sorta becoming a problem for everyone in LFG, now :( So basically, it's MORE waiting, and furthers the negative hunter stigma. Heck, hunters are turning on each other. There's no way I can agree that disallowing a drop in LFR - it can even be a low drop rate! - is a good idea. And I had heroic on farm til we got bored with it and quit til the next raid.

Edit; Man, I don't even wanna log in, I don't wanna see the crawg pets running around. There are enough trophies in WoW, a pet family shouldn't have been one.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Iowawolf » Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:02 am

GormanGhaste wrote:Nope, I'll tame a blood tick a couple of expansions from now if I'm still playing.
Go on the secret discord I just got my tome thanks to them.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Valnaaros » Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:14 am

Wain wrote:Can anyone think of a logical thought process that would lead us to try an all-hunter raid? I can't remember any clue to trying it, nor any form of reason that would lead us to the conclusion of trying it. Was this just one of those "try random shit" puzzles suited to larger groups like the WoW Secrets community? If so I'm concerned.
There isn’t a single thing that would have led us to attempting an all Hunter Zul kill. Honestly, if it wasn’t for the bug and someone accidentally finding out how to do it, it may have been far longer before we actually discovered it. Probably would’ve require more hints before we came to that conclusion.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Iowawolf » Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:20 am

I know Blizzard has done really dumb things of late and they almost done goofed again but I want to applaud them for fixing this so fast also changing it from just mythic/heroic to normal as well I just got mine on normal thanks to the secret discord having a group going to help hunters. If it was locked at heroic or mythic only many of us would be screwed so thank you Blizzard for at least letting us get the tome in normal.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by SlickrockGhost » Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:56 am

Wain wrote:For anyone hesitant, Normal mode is often much easier than LFR, especially on trickier bosses. This is because it's more likely people have read up on the fight and are actually trying, rather than expecting to be carried. The bosses usually aren't much harder, though the mechanics can change a little now and then. LFR is a horrible nightmare in comparison.
More true than ever this expac. LFR is a hellhole compared to normal.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by SlickrockGhost » Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:59 am

Wain wrote:Can anyone think of a logical thought process that would lead us to try an all-hunter raid? I can't remember any clue to trying it, nor any form of reason that would lead us to the conclusion of trying it. Was this just one of those "try random shit" puzzles suited to larger groups like the WoW Secrets community? If so I'm concerned.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Lycanthrope » Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:19 am

Iowawolf wrote:I know Blizzard has done really dumb things of late and they almost done goofed again but I want to applaud them for fixing this so fast also changing it from just mythic/heroic to normal as well I just got mine on normal thanks to the secret discord having a group going to help hunters. If it was locked at heroic or mythic only many of us would be screwed so thank you Blizzard for at least letting us get the tome in normal.
Are they still running any groups?

All I see if complaining about "casuals" getting their hands on the newest pet family.... =/

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Iowawolf » Mon Dec 24, 2018 1:30 am

Lycanthrope wrote:
Iowawolf wrote:I know Blizzard has done really dumb things of late and they almost done goofed again but I want to applaud them for fixing this so fast also changing it from just mythic/heroic to normal as well I just got mine on normal thanks to the secret discord having a group going to help hunters. If it was locked at heroic or mythic only many of us would be screwed so thank you Blizzard for at least letting us get the tome in normal.
Are they still running any groups?

All I see if complaining about "casuals" getting their hands on the newest pet family.... =/
Not right now I don't think so but it is late at night best bet is try during the day or earlier in the evening.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by pop » Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:41 am

So do i need to be in an ALL HUNTER group to kill this pos stuff?

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Wain » Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:44 am

pop wrote:So do i need to be in an ALL HUNTER group to kill this pos stuff?
No. That was what they originally intended but they changed it with this hotfix. It was also originally meant to be Heroic, but it works in Normal too.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Wain » Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:46 am

I also wanted to add, thank you everyone for your company on this strange brainstorming session to find Blood Beasts. It's a shame in the end it turned out to be something we really had no hope of finding, but the effort everyone put in was massive and much appreciated :) I hope everyone can get into a Normal group and get the tome :)

If you happen to have a raid group that can offer help to a few pugs, maybe we could start a thread here :)
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Qraljar » Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:48 am

Lycanthrope wrote:
All I see if complaining about "casuals" getting their hands on the newest pet family.... =/
I've seen so much of this already and it just makes me wonder how many of them are hunters when I see

"Hurr durr Blizzard catering to the casuals again by dumbing things down. Can't anything be special and hard to get?"

At this point, it feels pathological, compulsive. People see "this thing was made easier than it was intended to be," and they just start going off about the horrible entitled casuals who dare expect that a fairly heavily advertised new pet family for 8.1 should be obtainable by people who aren't deeply entrenched in the raiding scene.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by evil950510 » Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:29 am

The hint was "Zul hides this prestigious tome from all but the most Heroic hunters.", implying more than one Hunter killing Zul on Heroic difficulty; however, even if we had figured this out before the bug or hot-fix how would we be able to kill him with our current gear? First a group of Hunters would have to fight their way through the first four bosses and the trash, or having a Hunter who had killed all the bosses up to Zul make a group. This though would mean they had dropped out right before Zul in order to be saved, but then this would cause pugs to not invite Hunters knowing they may just drop out before Zul. Then there would have to be the gear check there is no chance of killing Zul unless the group is full of top tier players locking out casual players. All the secrecy around this item seems to indicated that even though Blizzard may had added the tome in 8.1 it was meant not meant to be found or attempted until after Battle of Dazar'alor and we were more geared to try the challenge again being time-gated content. Blizzard seems to have the new motto of carrot on a stick, they show us what we want but keep it just out of our reach, keeping us preoccupied and pumping money into their game.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Teigan » Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:24 am

Qraljar wrote:
Lycanthrope wrote:
All I see if complaining about "casuals" getting their hands on the newest pet family.... =/
I've seen so much of this already and it just makes me wonder how many of them are hunters when I see

"Hurr durr Blizzard catering to the casuals again by dumbing things down. Can't anything be special and hard to get?"

At this point, it feels pathological, compulsive. People see "this thing was made easier than it was intended to be," and they just start going off about the horrible entitled casuals who dare expect that a fairly heavily advertised new pet family for 8.1 should be obtainable by people who aren't deeply entrenched in the raiding scene.
I tend to think alot of the rage-screaming about casuals is not coming from hunters. It's coming from people who frankly don't need to be getting in on this conversation and simply like to make trouble and yell at people. Aka trolls. It's very aggravating. Which is exactly why those people do it.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Wain » Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:34 am

evil950510 wrote:The hint was "Zul hides this prestigious tome from all but the most Heroic hunters.", implying more than one Hunter killing Zul on Heroic difficulty;
If that was the intent it wasn't expressed well, since semantically the word "hunters" in that sentence would normally imply a generic noun rather than a plural. Like "I take photos of dogs" doesn't imply that multiple dogs are in each photo I take.
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by evil950510 » Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:31 am

Wain wrote:
evil950510 wrote:The hint was "Zul hides this prestigious tome from all but the most Heroic hunters.", implying more than one Hunter killing Zul on Heroic difficulty;
If that was the intent it wasn't expressed well, since semantically the word "hunters" in that sentence would normally imply a generic noun rather than a plural. Like "I take photos of dogs" doesn't imply that multiple dogs are in each photo I take.
Either they thought they were being very clear or it was worded just to make it more vague to waste more time in solving it we will not know. Blizzard has been very poor at communication with most aspects of this expansion and would just chalk it up to them thinking they are more cleaver than the players.

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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Wain » Mon Dec 24, 2018 8:47 am

*Warning: rant ahead*

Absolutely. I don't have any insight into their corporae machinations, but their behaviour seems strongly like that of a company where communication has been placed in the hands of marketing and PR, where designers can now publicly say very little of substance and what ends up coming out of Ion's Q&A is a torrent of marketing/PR-jargon that actually says not much and is dissatisfying to anyone with any experience with that kind of babble. Even when there are apologies they come across as strategically chosen. And I don't think this is Ion's fault. I mean, perhaps it is, but my gut feeling is he's doing and saying what he's told.

I can say with confidence, from speaking with other fansite managers, that in an official capacity Blizzard do very little to support most of the fan websites that support them. They've all but cut ties to the web community, where 5 years ago they used to ask what they could do to help. I emphasize "official capacity" because we hunters have been incredibly lucky to have had designer interest in our pets to the point where they've gone above and beyond to get us new things every patch. This is amazing and no other class gets this.

If you've followed their PR they have put all their marketing energy into supporting streamers and almost nothing else. And from some of their other choices I can guess that the people driving this (i) don't always know WoW all that well, which makes me suspect it's coming from a different division and isn't (always) internal and (ii) feel to me to be about 5 years out of date in their approach. Plus, whoever is responsible for PR nightmares like that Diablo Immortal presentation at Blizzcon deserves to be demoted - and it wasn't the designers on stage, I felt really bad for them, they were the poor bastards who were sent out to be crucified. But if experience tells me anything, PR and marketing people are as good at dodging the consequences of their actions as any politician or any other BS-driven occupation.

*rant over*
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Re: Blood Beast taming search

Unread post by Myzou » Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:28 am

I wanna know how they thought we'd even manage to down Zul in an all hunter raid before next xpac.

ilvl is only going up by like 15-20 every raid tier, and even pugging a NORMAL Zul you still wipe a ton, and that's even if you have priests for Mass Dispel. Mend Pet barely heals nowadays, and our pets are squishier than ever. My pet dies in 2 hits from Zul in Normal, and gets 1 shot by a Crusher, so I can't even imagine what would happen in heroic.

Not to mention, due to the mechanics of the Zul fight, Horde would have a SERIOUS advantage, like, astronomical, over Alliance groups due to Blood Elf AoE dispel.

I can't even fathom the stupidity that went into the idea of "Oh, let's make it drop from all hunters killing heroic Zul!"

I normally try my best to support challenge things, but this was just ridiculous. If they really wanted it to be something challenging do it in a dungeon or something, not a goddamn raid.

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