Hunter spec change discussion

[Qraljar]

I agree with Wain. MM, to me, always felt like it shouldn't have a pet at all. Archers, typically, never had one, and that's what MM represents and now can represent that properly.

Eh, I thought it worked just fine being optional (Lone Wolf), so I don't see why they'd have to make it a thing for all MMs.

[Heleos]

I am SOOOO excited about a melee hunter. <(^_^)>

[Bambu]

Hmm, the regret of a hundred vendored unique polearms and staves is setting in I just realized.

[Makoes]

I had to check to make sure that I hadn't done my "void clear out" yet on my main hunter...Yay, my polearms and staves are safe!! Including some quest exclusive looks.
if SV is going to be a melee spec, I actually have a reason now to choose an off spec. (because ranged dps, or ranged dps, or ranged dps...kinda felt redundant as a hunter)

[Layiaissa]

Hmm, the regret of a hundred vendored unique polearms and staves is setting in I just realized.

Might want to start doing some item restorations now, see if they're still there.

[Shade]

I do not like the idea that much-but then I do not play MM that often so it will not affect me that much. As long as they do not try to pull such a thing with BM I will be okay.

But I do find it frustrating and a bit limiting in class/spec choices as a whole in the game. Here is how:

Warrior-tank or melee DPS
Paladin-tank, melee DPS, healer
Hunter-range, non-magic DPS
Rogue-melee DPS
Priest-heals or range magic DPS
DK-tank or melee DPS
Shaman-heals, melee DPS, range magic DPS
Mage-range magic DPS
Warlock-range magic DPS
Monk-tank, melee DPS, healer
Druid-tank, melee DPS, range magic DPS, healer
Demon Hunter-tank or melee DPS

Hunter is the ONLY ranged, non-magic DPS in the game, and if they are making MM a melee-then there is now only one class and two specs within that class for non-magic range DPS. That feels really unbalanced and restricted for someone who generally only prefers range classes such as myself. I'm okay playing some of the range magic DPS classes, but I wish they would give more options, instead of less, for a non-magic range class or spec.

I just hope that the next hero class they release will have a range option-magic or not-instead of again being tank/melee. I know some people do like those specs, but there are also people who do not and for me that makes it hard to get really excited about the class. (Don't get me wrong, the new class looks neat, but I cannot see myself getting into it for too long. I will try it as I have tried all of the classes so far but... eh.)

[SylviaDragon]

"As an example of class changes, the Survival Hunter 'spear' Artifact was brought up. In Legion, Survival Hunters will be a melee spec that utilizes a pet. To differentiate specializations, the developers will try to de-homogenize the classes. Further to this, Beast Mastery Hunters will fight at range with a pet, while Marksmanship Hunters will fight at range with NO PET."

full interview can be found here.

http://www.icy-veins.com/forums/topic/1 ... zzikostas/

personally i am kind of bummed out. I feel like this is going to displace a lot of people. i chose a hunter because I wanted to be ranged. I will miss my surv offspec for sure. I feel like we already have a saturation in melee classes unless they plan to switch up the specs of other classes to add ranged options.

lots of other interesting points in the interview aside from hunters. some of them sound good. others worry me. go read!

[Bambu]

Might want to start doing some item restorations now, see if they're still there.

Good idea! Forgot about that service. Thanks!

[Shinryu Masaki]

Beast Master = Ranged with pet
Marksmanship = Ranged without pet
Survival = Melee with pet

So BM mostly stays the same, while MM get Lone Wolf baseline, and SV is going melee. That will shock a LOT of MM and SV hunters. But at the same time it will at least give more spec uniqueness. SV did have more melee things going on with them back in vanilla, and I think it will help them work with their traps a lot better now, possibly getting more of them.

Side note, in the interview video I saw, they also talked about Disc Priest's absorbs not working well and they decided to instead go with 50/50 damage healing with Attonement, similar to Mistweaver monks.

[Shade]

I feel like we already have a saturation in melee classes unless they plan to switch up the specs of other classes to add ranged options.

My thoughts exactly.

[ehrinlove]

I'm a bit sad to be honest.. I LOVED sv for the longest time, pet, range and all it was where I was most comfortable, its my main my hunter, I hate lonewolf with a passion, and I dislike playing melee class's... so I will be forced into BM if I want to keep playing my main, which means I'll be forced into using an exotic pet mostly, rather then my preferred.. or forced into the 'viable' raid spec when its decided *sighs* I just hope its one of the ranged ones, or else I'm going to my mage

[Lupen202]

I think there could be other ways to differentiate the specs, like give Surv throwing knives or spears, but still allow them to use guns and such or something. I don't know if that could even work, but seeing a hunter throwing spears would be badass They could always give them more specialized traps and poisons too that the other specs don't have. Like a net snare that works like a druid's roots or perhaps an improved camouflage that stealths you even when moving with no hindrance to your movement speed.

But I've always preferred BM so it doesn't affect me too much, and I might try out surv anyways just to see how being melee on my main feels..

[Lisaara]

Beast Master = Ranged with pet
Marksmanship = Ranged without pet
Survival = Melee with pet

So BM mostly stays the same, while MM get Lone Wolf baseline, and SV is going melee. That will shock a LOT of MM and SV hunters. But at the same time it will at least give more spec uniqueness. SV did have more melee things going on with them back in vanilla, and I think it will help them work with their traps a lot better now, possibly getting more of them.

Side note, in the interview video I saw, they also talked about Disc Priest's absorbs not working well and they decided to instead go with 50/50 damage healing with Attonement, similar to Mistweaver monks.

Agreed! And sorry Lupen, but what you're mentioning is what rogue's kinda already do...^^;

To fix a class that is broken, there needs to be changes. This, I think, was the best way they could've done it.

[Lisaara]

Guys, they're not making MM melee. They're making SV melee. Also, looking back on non-magical ranged.....there isn't much if anything else other than the 'Archer', which in our case, that's MM. Most other 'ranged', even in D&D, is magic based.

The reason DH are melee is cause that's how they've always been in lore. They've never ever been a ranged class. Changing that just to appease a few people that don't know the lore or just want a ranged class would've been bad and inconsistent with the lore.

[Pepsi Jedi]

I'm actually pretty happy with the changes that we're seeing.

That said, this is way way early in development. Any and all of it could change.

Survival? Never played it. So I'm fine with it going melee/pet. I think it fits. I also think spear throwing and pet would be cool, but Survival being about traps and what not, the spear thing works for them.

Marksman, ranged with no pet? I'm fine there too. In marksman your pet has always been minimal. It's been more about the Hunter's own damage, and moving it down range. The pet was mostly just an assessory. You played marksman to be a non magical ranged class. They don't 'need' the pet.

Beast mastery, ranged with pet. Our damage has always come with large portions/percentages from the pet. It was the dedicated 'Pet" class/spec.

As per the weapons we'll get?

There's images of a Bow and a gun.

I'm hoping that the Bow goes to Beast Masters. I prefer bows, so getting stuck with a gun (As I'm BM) Would be rather depressing as it seems we're keeping these weapons all expansion.

I think Marksman will get the gun. Why? ___MARKSMAN___ Not "Archer". Marksmen are expert shots. Snipers. While you 'can' do that with a bow, it conjures more images with the gun.

So I'm hoping it breaks down like that.

If it does. I like how it's set up. If Beast Masters get the gun... ehh.. I'll see how it looks. I'm not going to rage quit or anything, but I'll be slightly less pleased.

As it is though, I'm very happy about the splitting up the specs and I'm happy Survival got the spear (As being BM. I don't WANT the spear. lol I like my hunter in the back, My spiffy Fel wolf up biting the face)

[Quiv]

This still doesn't make sense to me. Sure I can see Survival being changed into melee, that part I get. However their reasoning was based on the fantasy of the classes/specs. Do we have a melee Survival hunter in any part of the lore? Any character whatsoever from which to derive fantasy? We do have a major hunter character that is a melee beastmaster (in fact he is THE beastmaster). Just seems to me that if fantasy was a big motivation for this, they ignored a large and already well established portion of the hunter fantasy. Thats what I don't get. I could just imagine Rexxar teaching us how to melee as Beastmasters.

At the end of the day, they are going to upset folks with this. There will be those who like both specs as is and don't want them changed (and choosing to change the one that supposedly pisses off fewer players is not a good enough reason to pick it). Just seems strange, but maybe I am missing a reference somewhere. Sylvanas strikes me the closest we have to a Survival hunter (uses Black Arrow and Multi-shot etc) and she is most definitely ranged.

Edit: Unless they are basing this on the old Raptor Strike etc melee abilities.

[Lisaara]

Well so far, the responses, from what I saw earlier today on twitter and stuff, have actually been positive for the most part. Sylvannas is prob an MM hunter, not survival. She was a ranger(which is what MM is becoming truly).

Any change usually upsets somebody somewhere.

[crimzon07]

I'm actually pretty happy with the changes that we're seeing.

That said, this is way way early in development. Any and all of it could change.

Survival? Never played it. So I'm fine with it going melee/pet. I think it fits. I also think spear throwing and pet would be cool, but Survival being about traps and what not, the spear thing works for them.

Marksman, ranged with no pet? I'm fine there too. In marksman your pet has always been minimal. It's been more about the Hunter's own damage, and moving it down range. The pet was mostly just an assessory. You played marksman to be a non magical ranged class. They don't 'need' the pet.

Beast mastery, ranged with pet. Our damage has always come with large portions/percentages from the pet. It was the dedicated 'Pet" class/spec.

As per the weapons we'll get?

There's images of a Bow and a gun.

I'm hoping that the Bow goes to Beast Masters. I prefer bows, so getting stuck with a gun (As I'm BM) Would be rather depressing as it seems we're keeping these weapons all expansion.

I think Marksman will get the gun. Why? ___MARKSMAN___ Not "Archer". Marksmen are expert shots. Snipers. While you 'can' do that with a bow, it conjures more images with the gun.

So I'm hoping it breaks down like that.

If it does. I like how it's set up. If Beast Masters get the gun... ehh.. I'll see how it looks. I'm not going to rage quit or anything, but I'll be slightly less pleased.

As it is though, I'm very happy about the splitting up the specs and I'm happy Survival got the spear (As being BM. I don't WANT the spear. lol I like my hunter in the back, My spiffy Fel wolf up biting the face)

BM has the Gun, MM has the bow, and Survival has the spear.

This is the thing I am displeased about. I want to use my pet and have a bow. So I will have to transmog over my artifact.

[Wain]

I'm a bit sad to be honest.. I LOVED sv for the longest time, pet, range and all it was where I was most comfortable, its my main my hunter, I hate lonewolf with a passion, and I dislike playing melee class's... so I will be forced into BM if I want to keep playing my main, which means I'll be forced into using an exotic pet mostly, rather then my preferred.. or forced into the 'viable' raid spec when its decided *sighs* I just hope its one of the ranged ones, or else I'm going to my mage

BM Hunters don't feel so forced to use exotics these days. Usually a raid covers everything and they can bring what they like.

Having said that, it does remind me of something we discussed once before here, that it might be a good time to abolish the concept of "Exotics" entirely and allow all hunters access to them. Conceptually, there isn't a lot of difference between the types of creatures that are classed as Exotic and the many weird and wonderful things that aren't. Things have changed so much since the early days and the choices for what goes into Exotic seem a lot more arbitrary now. They kind of have to be, or non-BM Hunters would hardly get any new pets.

So I'm hoping they abolish the Exotic group and make BM about getting more out of your pet of ANY family. Maybe a bonus ability for every family, but only if you're BM, maybe two pets at once. And SV could have a spirit beast if they so wanted.

[Wain]

We developed two competing threads on the spec changes. I've now merged them since they were discussing the same things.