WoW Petopia Community

cowmuflage wrote:

Makoes wrote: On top of that, there has been a steady decrease in the feel of the world

That really depends on the person.

Games always loose players and gain them it's just how it is with MMOs and the older they get the more it happens. It's a natural thing. Most MMO's don't live longer then a few years

True. Also, keep in mind...

- Despite this drop in subscriptions, no matter how large or small, none of the competition has even come close.
- A number of older MMOs are still around. As long as there's subscribers, they all will be.
- Spring is in the air and people are rediscovering this strange world called "outdoors."
- Winter is coming.

Vephriel wrote: I probably just need a break, haha.

We all need breaks from time to time

Agravaine wrote:

cowmuflage wrote:

Makoes wrote: On top of that, there has been a steady decrease in the feel of the world

That really depends on the person.

Games always loose players and gain them it's just how it is with MMOs and the older they get the more it happens. It's a natural thing. Most MMO's don't live longer then a few years

True. Also, keep in mind...

- Despite this drop in subscriptions, no matter how large or small, none of the competition has even come close.
- A number of older MMOs are still around. As long as there's subscribers, they all will be.
- Spring is in the air and people are rediscovering this strange world called "outdoors."
- Winter is coming.

I'm not sure, LoL is currently the most played video game of all time. And with the competitive scene growing in it, as well as other games, such as SC2 (still blizz I know.) and CoD, if they don't do something to figure out the drops, we could see much steeper drops than before. I know myself personally have been way more into LoL than WoW, because the PvP is much more interesting, and BALANCED. Plus, there is no massive gear grind, only to have it replaced in a few weeks.

While Blizz is still a titan in the gaming industry, it will need to do something in order to survive as a P2P MMO, especially when competing against a mass of F2P ones like LoL, BF4 (Playstation is F2P, and it's a one time cost to purchase the game.) CoD, etc.

Gimlion wrote:
I'm not sure, LoL is currently the most played video game of all time. And with the competitive scene growing in it, as well as other games, such as SC2 (still blizz I know.) and CoD, if they don't do something to figure out the drops, we could see much steeper drops than before. I know myself personally have been way more into LoL than WoW, because the PvP is much more interesting, and BALANCED. Plus, there is no massive gear grind, only to have it replaced in a few weeks.

While Blizz is still a titan in the gaming industry, it will need to do something in order to survive as a P2P MMO, especially when competing against a mass of F2P ones like LoL, BF4 (Playstation is F2P, and it's a one time cost to purchase the game.) CoD, etc.

Well I would not say it's going against something like BF4 or LoL as they all are different types of games. Heck BF4 is not even a MMO it's a FPS and that's a totally different market.

cowmuflage wrote:

Gimlion wrote:
I'm not sure, LoL is currently the most played video game of all time. And with the competitive scene growing in it, as well as other games, such as SC2 (still blizz I know.) and CoD, if they don't do something to figure out the drops, we could see much steeper drops than before. I know myself personally have been way more into LoL than WoW, because the PvP is much more interesting, and BALANCED. Plus, there is no massive gear grind, only to have it replaced in a few weeks.

While Blizz is still a titan in the gaming industry, it will need to do something in order to survive as a P2P MMO, especially when competing against a mass of F2P ones like LoL, BF4 (Playstation is F2P, and it's a one time cost to purchase the game.) CoD, etc.

Well I would not say it's going against something like BF4 or LoL as they all are different types of games. Heck BF4 is not even a MMO it's a FPS and that's a totally different market.

Not necessarily. They are all multiplayer games, and I'd say LoL is similar enough to rival WoW directly. But even the others that are 'out of Genre' have very powerful chances at capturing players from all sorts of games. With the next Gen consoles being released, we, as a gaming community, will see graphics unlike anything we've ever seen. The jump is going to be astronomical. And with strong story-telling or user-friendly online-play, these games can suck in anyone, and as gamers, WoW players are already susceptible to great graphics and stories drawing them in.

Any gaming company would be foolish to ignore these new F2P games and next-gen consoles being released, regardless of whether they're deemed as direct competition or not.

Well, they've said 'most of the losses come from China'. I'm betting it has as much or more to do with either China's restrictive internet policies, or them finally getting the boot to a bunch of gold farmers.

Frankly, good riddance, in my mind.

Gimlion wrote:Not necessarily. They are all multiplayer games, and I'd say LoL is similar enough to rival WoW directly. But even the others that are 'out of Genre' have very powerful chances at capturing players from all sorts of games. With the next Gen consoles being released, we, as a gaming community, will see graphics unlike anything we've ever seen. The jump is going to be astronomical. And with strong story-telling or user-friendly online-play, these games can suck in anyone, and as gamers, WoW players are already susceptible to great graphics and stories drawing them in.

Any gaming company would be foolish to ignore these new F2P games and next-gen consoles being released, regardless of whether they're deemed as direct competition or not.

I disagree, MOBAs are significantly different from MMOs. The similarity is in the appearance but not in the gameplay. I knew someone would mention LoL, since it outsold WoW years ago. It is a force to be reckoned with, as you say, but here's the thing. I don't like MOBAs, nor do I like RTSes. And while I may be unusual, I'm certainly not alone. Tobold blogged about the differences between the gaming generations, and how WoW was originally geared towards Gen X gamers, but had to be retrofitted to appeal to Gen Y and younger. So lots of Gen Xers got disenchanted and left. But that's only part of it. There's people who left for other MMOs, left because of burnout, left because they just got tired of it. The Chinese subscribership was always shaky because of multiple issues -- licensing, censorship, the nature of asian subscription practises. Then there's seasonal players, as I alluded to originally, but all these people leaving are part of the normal cycle of an online game. In my guild, there are long periods where there's only a couple of members on. But there's a core that keeps coming back. One friend who actually came back to WoW from SWOTR because of something outrageous they did that was the last straw for him. What will keep WoW going is people like me (who are strange or whatever) and groups of family and friends who may leave but keep checking back.

Just like the older MMOs that are still alive.

MOBA games are very different from what WoW is. Personally, I don't like playing against other people and even though I do enjoy playing FPS games, I never use the multiplayer modes. I also despise RTS games. I'm strictly a PvE type and WoW allows me to be that while still having interaction with other people.

As for subscription numbers, LOTRO only has maybe 1 million or less subs but the game is thriving and delivering new content and expansions frequently. A subscription base of 8.3 million is still huge and would be even if it dropped as low as 5 million.

As a player of many games, I don't see why someone would invest so much time into PvP in an MMORPG such as WoW, when MOBAs and FPSs are much smoother, cheaper, and more balanced.

Regardless of "genre" these are all video games, and like I said before, it would be foolish to ignore these games and consoles as a gaming company. Especially knowing that LoL is currently the most played single video game of all time, free, and fantasy based. I never thought I'd like it, until a friend recruited me. I haven't touched PvP in WoW since. These sort of things Blizzard needs to pay attention to.

Gimlion wrote:As a player of many games, I don't see why someone would invest so much time into PvP in an MMORPG such as WoW, when MOBAs and FPSs are much smoother, cheaper, and more balanced.

Regardless of "genre" these are all video games, and like I said before, it would be foolish to ignore these games and consoles as a gaming company. Especially knowing that LoL is currently the most played single video game of all time, free, and fantasy based. I never thought I'd like it, until a friend recruited me. I haven't touched PvP in WoW since. These sort of things Blizzard needs to pay attention to.

I have to agree with you here. I haven't touched WoW PvP since I discovered LoL. However, for the whole "role-playing" part of the RPG and the PvE aspect, I stick with WoW. In LoL, you can't even use your champion outside of a game, and the only PvE there is are three minibosses and random jungle mobs.

So if anything, the MOBAs are only competing with the PvP aspect of games like World of Warcraft. Still, if a certain player is only attracted to RBGs and Arenas and then his class gets nerfed, he could ragequit and never come back.

It's pretty hard to predict the nature of subscribers.

Gimlion wrote:As a player of many games, I don't see why someone would invest so much time into PvP in an MMORPG such as WoW, when MOBAs and FPSs are much smoother, cheaper, and more balanced.

Regardless of "genre" these are all video games, and like I said before, it would be foolish to ignore these games and consoles as a gaming company. Especially knowing that LoL is currently the most played single video game of all time, free, and fantasy based. I never thought I'd like it, until a friend recruited me. I haven't touched PvP in WoW since. These sort of things Blizzard needs to pay attention to.

PvP, oh, how convenient! I used to PvP like a fiend for whatever gladiator gear was the latest, then I got burned out and sick of it and stopped. Then LFR kicked in and I haven't looked back... except to get enough PvP gear to let me into LFR. So I don't revel in PvP, never did. Always saw it as a means to an end. The same friend who left SWOTR to come back to WoW also transferred off my PvP server to a normal one because he was sick of getting ganked while leveling and actually wanted to play the game.

Here's another example of a "genre" that's dominated by PC and console juggernaughts. FPSes. Perfect examples are Halo and CoD franchises. The "competition" between the two is deceptive. Why? Because Halo as a major league game is console-exclusive, and serious CoD players are on PC. You may have heard the story that they tested play with a mix of PC and console players, where the PC group dominated the console players. That's right, the control offered by mouse and keyboard beat the console controllers every time. And this one's true. I had it from an industry insider. So these two games, while very hot rivals, can hardly be seen as in direct competition with each other. And you have to agree, both franchises are doing quite well.

But strangely, industry analysts seem to agree with you. Games that look similar, while not of the same "genre", seem to be competing against each other. When AC3 came out, Report on Business did a sales chart of Ubisoft games and their competitors. For the AC franchise, they listed Medal of Honour as its competitor. For the Tom Clancy franchise, they listed Resident Evil. Huh? Okay...

So yes, as I mentioned, LoL, though not a direct competitor has outsold WoW. It's already won. It's well-made, got great gameplay, it appeals to fantasy enthusiasts, it has all the hallmarks of success. Enjoy! Not my kind of game though. But I'm sure lots of Blizzard people play it and are watching it carefully to learn as much as they can. As they always have.

Eh, slightly off topic, but all MLG for CoD is xbox-based. BO2 did a great job bringing CoD into the MLG circuit, but it's all console-play, not PC play. These console players are the elite of the elite, and I would say they'd still beat pc players, the strategy and practice they put into it make them godlike. This practice and skill is unrivaled by PC players as there is no PC CoD MLG circuit.

But yes, similar graphics will always lead to competition. I agree, but I also believe that any successful franchise will work to lure in players from other genres/franchises, with graphics, story, playstyle etc. I'm not saying these games are direct competition, but they most certainly are competition in the gaming industry, and should be watched accordingly. All it takes is one screw up or bad patch to deter players and have them trying other games. Some come back, some choose not to leave, but as we're seeing, lots are picking up new games, and leaving WoW.

It shouldn't be a panic yet, as WoW still has 8.3 million subs, but they should be concerned as to what things they're doing to cause the loss in players.

I disagree with comparing WoW to LoL. PvP has never been the primary focus of wow, PvE is. LoL is pretty much just PvP from what i've seen so it always be a better experience that way, WoW's strong point was always PvE end content, dungeons and quests. Theres no point waiting for PvP to be "balanced" in wow cause it won't ever be because of the pve element (or everyone will be nerfed to the ground and just punch each other in mid field lol!).

But back to the main topic: I don't think they have anything to worry about with a drop in subs. Like others have already said people leave and come back all the time. Summer has just ended in Australia so more oceanic players will come back while the US/Europe players go outside and see the "world" lol. New games come out, ppl play them through and then go back as well. 8 Million is still awesome i think by any game standards.

Castile wrote:I disagree with comparing WoW to LoL. PvP has never been the primary focus of wow, PvE is. LoL is pretty much just PvP from what i've seen so it always be a better experience that way, WoW's strong point was always PvE end content, dungeons and quests. Theres no point waiting for PvP to be "balanced" in wow cause it won't ever be because of the pve element (or everyone will be nerfed to the ground and just punch each other in mid field lol!).

But back to the main topic: I don't think they have anything to worry about with a drop in subs. Like others have already said people leave and come back all the time. Summer has just ended in Australia so more oceanic players will come back while the US/Europe players go outside and see the "world" lol. New games come out, ppl play them through and then go back as well. 8 Million is still awesome i think by any game standards.

Agreed. The subs always fluctuate. People get in a tizzy all the time even though this is barely a bent in WoW's sub base. People need to take into account several factors, such as the US economy, as well as the fact Blizz said these were mostly asians they lost.

i love when websites go crazy when wow subs drop a bit.. wow still has more subs than tera,star wars,rift,GW2,and the secret world combined...

Gimlion wrote:the strategy and practice they put into it make them godlike. This practice and skill is unrivaled by PC players as there is no PC CoD MLG circuit.

Exactly, because that's what practice does. The fact remains that to this day there is no combined PC and console play, because in testing, PC dominated.

At any rate, you've repeated yourself thrice now and we still disagree -- at least we agree that juggernaut games are forces to be reckoned with, but not why.

i know theres another game comeing out called dragon's prophet but i still end up playing wow.cause even though some ppl may play 1 game there is still some things in another game that the 1 game does not have but you still enjoy both.

**looks are her EQ/EQ2 accts** EQ is 14years old and still releasing xpacs every freaking 6 months and I pay for a month here and there for both of them at times because I still love playing them. WoW is like that for me too actually I'm just more burnt out on it that normal right now but that has been for all games actually. I have GW2 and I play that on occasion and I log on to EQ and EQ2 as F2P some as well(grumbles about WoW not haveing that option for me). But I'm starting to feel that MMO itch again and as the summer gets freaking hotter down here in TX the more I want to stay in and play MMO's. ;D

I kinda debate playing GW2, because the idea that other players aren't always competition for nodes/mobs is really, really, really nice (Thanks, xxArthasJrxx, it's not like I wanted to tame that spirit beast ANYWAY). I'm giving Marvel Heroes a shot because a few of my favorites are in there. That, and there's something poetic about hitting things with rocket launchers.

Novikova wrote:I kinda debate playing GW2, because the idea that other players aren't always competition for nodes/mobs is really, really, really nice (Thanks, xxArthasJrxx, it's not like I wanted to tame that spirit beast ANYWAY).

Despite GW2 being so, so much younger than WoW, I think they actually have a lot to learn from it. What you pointed out, for instance. Imagine what that would do to botters in WoW? There'd be so much less reason for them to go out and do that; those nodes will still be there for everyone else, so they're not going to buy as much. Yet it wouldn't affect the economy as a whole as much. There will always be people who need more mats but don't want to go find them and there will always be people who have extra and need some gold. It just means one person isn't going around and snatching up every node and not leaving any for other people.

I think graphics is another area where they could improve. We have a number of models that haven't been updated since Vanilla, and it shows. It makes it harder to bring in new subscribers. Why would people go for WoW when they can play GW2, which is prettier, allows for complete customization, and you only have to pay for it once? Especially since there's a long standing stigma against paying WoW?

They need to sit down and look at all the things GW2 is doing right and see if they can implement them.

And now we get to talk about prices. Let's talk about how much I've payed for WoW just in expansions, ignoring monthly fees. That $60 for Vanilla, $60 for BC, $60 for Wrath, $60 for Cata, $60 for MoP. And how much I've payed for GW2? $60, which is all well and good, since GW2 hasn't had any expansions yet. Things seem balanced, right? GW2 is right on level with WoW!

Except that dratted $15 every month.

I don't have a solution for this part of the problem, but I can guarantee it's a large part of what's pushing people away. There are up and coming MMOs that seem to just be better than WoW as is, and they're better for your pocket, too. A number of the people I've met in GW2 have switched to it from WoW and RIFT. And it hasn't been a temporary thing, either.

At the moment, WoW survives with its large player base because it's the titan that paved the way for most of these other games. But they haven't been keeping up with the times. Can you tell me that is WoW was an up and coming game, as it is now, it would do well? Because I don't think it would.

That in mind, I'm not going anywhere. I still log on most every day. But if they don't change with the times, they're going to have problems.