WoW Petopia Community

So, I've seen the CC comments and heard about them, and seen the comments here.

I know the ultimate goal of this is to remove any taming restrictions. Let anyone tame anything any time, and certainly not add any new exotic specs.

So.. I have to ask bluntly. What's left for BM besides Bestial Wrath? If the exotics are removed, or limited to solely Spirit Beasts, what reason would ANYONE play BM? (Spirit Beasts are garbage now for utility, since Spirit Mend is so bad, and other pets like Clefthoof are always a better choice.)

If you remove most/all of the exotics, BM has nothing left. It would always be better to play MM or SV if you are a competent player. It's bad enough now in the raiding and M+ community, and this would just make it worse.

Of course, the ideal would be that any pet would have an exotic ability. That would be fantastic. We also know that there's 0% chance of Blizzard doing that.

I'm infuriated that the leaders of this community are actively pushing to remove exotic families from BM, which also means removing their special abilities (goodbye Blood of the Rhino), all in the name of "collect all the things".

But I'll ask again. What does BM have left if exotics get pruned or removed completely? Beastial Wrath? Is a big red pet enough for a spec to be worth playing? No.

"the ideal would be that any pet would have an exotic ability. That would be fantastic"
Pretty much this, And pets. Idealy all BM pets would have blood of the rhino, all bm pets would have something cool about them that makes them better. Be it blood, built in tough scales etc etc.
While blood of the rhino is a good skill, it's become a problem in itself. If you wana do any tanking solo. You have to have a clefthoof now, no options.

You play mm for ranged no pet, you play SV for Melee with pet.
You play bm for beast cleave tons of pets and summons.
All exotics are is a type of pet. That's like saying why would people play Demonology if Afliction and destro got felguards.

Barrage is bm only? That's a good skill imo.
But I agree. Blood of the rhino should be on all bm pets and bm only. Switching between pet specs should be bm only. Would fit a beastmaster to control their pets this way.
Pet trees all should have acces too but above should be bm only

Maria wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:33 pm Barrage is bm only? That's a good skill imo.
But I agree. Blood of the rhino should be on all bm pets and bm only. Switching between pet specs should be bm only. Would fit a beastmaster to control their pets this way.
Pet trees all should have acces too but above should be bm only

Barrage is a terrible terrible spell. It's bad on damage, and it's a disaster in raid or M+.

Blood of the Rhino would be gone if Wain's suggestions get made. BM really only would have Spirit Beasts.

Yes, it would be great if all pet families get exotic abilities, but what I greatly fear is we'll get the other side. Exotics removed and nothing to compensate.

My frustration is that the focus is on "letting anyone tame anything" and not on making BM a compelling and useful spec.

DannyGreen wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:16 pm All exotics are is a type of pet. That's like saying why would people play Demonology if Afliction and destro got felguards.

That's exactly what's being asked for. MM and SV hunters want to tame the exotic families. Why would you play BM?

Also, if you look at the new DF BM tree.. there are really 2 options. You go Dire Beast and Cleave, or you go solo pet and pour your power into Cobra Shot and Barbed Shot. Mixing those is going to be a "master of none".

DannyGreen wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:16 pm While blood of the rhino is a good skill, it's become a problem in itself. If you wana do any tanking solo. You have to have a clefthoof now, no options.

Yes, this is a problem for solo content, but the "fix" that's suggested is to just remove it, and make Clefthooves normal. That's just an nerf.

BM is going to be bad in DF if they make changes along these lines.

CrankyClaw wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:47 pm

Maria wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:33 pm Barrage is bm only? That's a good skill imo.
But I agree. Blood of the rhino should be on all bm pets and bm only. Switching between pet specs should be bm only. Would fit a beastmaster to control their pets this way.
Pet trees all should have acces too but above should be bm only

Barrage is a terrible terrible spell. It's bad on damage, and it's a disaster in raid or M+.

Blood of the Rhino would be gone if Wain's suggestions get made. BM really only would have Spirit Beasts.

Yes, it would be great if all pet families get exotic abilities, but what I greatly fear is we'll get the other side. Exotics removed and nothing to compensate.

My frustration is that the focus is on "letting anyone tame anything" and not on making BM a compelling and useful spec.

Well i like barrage but then again when I played i played solo. Dont care for grp or raids so can't say what would make bm good in those contents. I can only comment on what I do play

Maria wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:57 pm Well i like barrage but then again when I played i played solo. Dont care for grp or raids so can't say what would make bm good in those contents. I can only comment on what I do play

No offense, but that's part of the problem. Many of the voices on this are from solo/casual players who rarely if ever group, and certainly aren't doing progression content.

There's certainly nothing wrong with that playstyle, but suggestions need to be made that make BM viable at all levels. BM is in a bad place right now, and neutering it more isn't going to help.

(Where did I put my shadow priest.. I feel I might need her....)

Bm, being in a bad place now is perfectly fine.
It's how Warcraft works.
One day BM is top of the dps charts, next patch they aren't. Sv was bottom of the list till the last patch of the past 2-3 expansions. Just how it goes.
Afliction was first place in the first 2 patches, now it's bottom.

As for the whole tree thing. That's kinda how most trees seem to work. SV do you wana go bomb, or do you wana go mongoose
Ontop of this, most fotm shit will just copy whatever guide icyveins gives you anyway.

"My frustration is that the focus is on "letting anyone tame anything" and not on making BM a compelling and useful spec."
Flavor of the month. One day it's good, one day it's bad. Such is life.
Pet's are always around and something that all 3 specs can enjoy

"Blood of the Rhino would be gone if Wain's suggestions get made"
No it would be gone from the other 2 specs, but BM would still have it. Bm would still have all the special exotic skills like silathid movement speed, where as a SV/MM with a silathid would not have dunestrider, or eternal guardian, or burrow etc.
And Cats would get an extra bonus like I dunno rending talons that adds mortal wound as a bonus.

Some of us were BM before spirit beasts I think it's a just a little early in the dev cycle to panic.

GormanGhaste wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:06 pm Some of us were BM before spirit beasts I think it's a just a little early in the dev cycle to panic.

Agree

DannyGreen wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:01 pm Bm, being in a bad place now is perfectly fine.

Flavor of the month. One day it's good, one day it's bad. Such is life.

No it would be gone from the other 2 specs, but BM would still have it. Bm would still have all the special exotic..

Being fine with BM being trash means I don't raid. Might be ok for you.. not for me.

What beast would Blood of the Rhino be added to? I just see recommendations about it being removed.

GormanGhaste wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:06 pm Some of us were BM before spirit beasts I think it's a just a little early in the dev cycle to panic.

I'm not worried (yet) about what I see in the dev cycle, it's the recommendations from this community that's the problem. 99% of the players here are solo/casual, so the recommendations don't reflect other playstyles.

(Reminds me.. I'm surprised that we aren't seeming MM players complaining that Wailing Arrow is BM only, so they can't play Dark Ranger with it..)

CrankyClaw wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:48 pm

GormanGhaste wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:06 pm Some of us were BM before spirit beasts I think it's a just a little early in the dev cycle to panic.

I'm not worried (yet) about what I see in the dev cycle, it's the recommendations from this community that's the problem. 99% of the players here are solo/casual, so the recommendations don't reflect other playstyles.

(Reminds me.. I'm surprised that we aren't seeming MM players complaining that Wailing Arrow is BM only, so they can't play Dark Ranger with it..)

Wailing Arrow is in both BM and MM actually, so it's a class fantasy that can fit both types of players

As for the suggestions in this community, I don't think we have any sort of particular sway over the final say in things, in fact most pet stuff seems to have gone against the hopes of this community and many others. We can express our interests here just as others can express their interests elsewhere, this is predominantly a pet loving community after all and not a top-end raid focused type so I wouldn't be surprised if the general consensus here differs from places like official forums or other end-game hunter spheres.

So, you're coming to a community forum where you believe almost no one shares your views. Seems like you're here just to complain about Wain's suggestion, but based on your comments you haven't even read it. While the suggestion is to allow anyone to use exotic pets, it also is for BM and BM hunters only to have a special exotic skill for every pet family. If anything, it is better for BM hunters than what we have now.

I think solo players should have just as much say as those who do grp and Raids.
We play the game too and our playstyle matters too.
Not sure if it ever be viable but the ideal to me is to play the entire game solo with npcs in your grp like ff14 is aiming for.
I respect others like mythics and end game progression but it's just not me. I enjoy playing my own paste and I always enjoyed solocontent and "story" way more than end game progression.
If it were up to me arena and mythics +n should be seperate games where ppl who wanted to could compete with others. It's more of a esport thing than it is mmorpg

But that's just me.
Anyways back to topic. Always played bm, even before exotics were a thing. Always will play bm

"Being fine with BM being trash means I don't raid. Might be ok for you.. not for me."

I mean, if you're going hardcore BM and refusing to change spec for optimal, that's on you. I'm not saying BM should be happy being bad I'm saying that hardcore raiders will always prioritise optimal. I been SV since Legion (BM hardcore before) Sometimes I didn't get into mythics or raids cos of spec. I just played the other specs, got my progress did something else. I don't see why it's such a huge thing.
Of course I want BM to be good, I want all specs to be good. But i'm also a realist. There's no way to perfectly balance every class, And even if all the specs were 1-2k between each other in damage. Some people would still only allow the top into content because that's how competative content works. Even if they were balanced to the decimal point. Some hunters would want BM to be renamed to Animal masters just so they can get higher than arms on the alphabetical chart.
Make some friends, do runs with them.

"What beast would Blood of the Rhino be added to? I just see recommendations about it being removed."

Then you haven't been reading much. Every BM pet should get blood of the rhino, regardless of who it is. Give clefthooves gore back for the knockback skill since they also are rhinos.
We've been saying make BM pets good, not just exotics. Because as it stands, if you're a BM and you're not using exotic pets. You're doing it wrong. It's the opposite of Non exotic pets. You're locked into these choices instead of locked out of them.

99% of the players here are solo/casual, so the recommendations don't reflect other playstyles.

As for my status in game. I'm mainly a battlepet collector. Do a lil RP, But i'm pug keystone master. 15-17 on most of them I got my mount I don't care for more it's just another color of it anyway, solo content etc.
My current thing is torghast wings. I have all the mage tower weapons, the new mage tower armor (not fun) Challenge weapons from Wod, The masks of visions pre nerf. So you can take my credentials how you like there.

I may be casual but I still do the content, Only reason I haven't raided this expansion is because I find the story pathetic and don't feel attached to any of it. But that's another subject.

My recommendations do reflect my personal views much like your own, dismissing everyones claims due to your views on playstyle is arguing in bad faith (hope I used that right) When I'm playing BM and I need to progress I feel like unless I have a tank or pocket healer and want to have my pet survive I need to play Clefthoof because blood of the rhino is mandatory to keep pets up at higher level content (solo heroic/mythics, higher torghast floors, mage tower)
I get attached to some pets, purely in the secondary pet slot because that's the only optional one that doesn't require ferocity or specific talents as it's just an extra npc.
Unfortunately when I go back to my main spec I have to abandon these pets and use a different one (when it comes to upcoming mythic season. Mandatory pets will by Ferocity with Mortal wounds)
So we come back to the original thing. Why are Hunter pets so restricted in the family and specs. Applying Blood of the rhino to all hunter pets makes them all just as tanky, giving clefthooves a new ability to replace. Along with buffing all other pets by giving them a bonus skill (if they are not exotic) Can only be seen as an overall buff.
As for the other two specs, you give them the Exotic pets without there bonus ability and no blood of the rhino... What do they gain?
They gain a bigger raptor.
They gain a hairy scale hide.
They gain a worm.
The idea of these beasts being mythical magical creatures is crap, since we already tame zombies and raptors and dragons and old god corrupted insects. Why can I suddenly not tame a spikey cow? Why is this 2 headed chimera suddenly so much more hassle than the 3 headed reptile or bird.
Want to make it fair?
Remove exotics entirely, just add a new skill to regular pets for BM. And have all exotics be book skills. Go to wod to find the rylak book. Go to firelands for the corehounds, Go to errrrr, deepholm? The place in the malestrum for the shale spiders etc etc etc.

Thank you for coming to my ted talk as I make fried chicken.

Here's an idea:

Let all hunter specs tame all pets.

Give BM these exclusive things:

- A unique 'mastery' skill for all pets. Doesn't have to be huge, just a nice little extra thing that only BM hunter pets have.
- The ability to (re)spec their pets. The other hunter specs would not be able to do this.

Both these things would reflect the ability of a beastmaster to truly train their pet in a way that the other specs can't.
Basically the flavour would be: Any hunter can tame a pet, but it takes a master level trainer to turn that pet into a finely trained companion.

I been sayin, just add a standardized pet talent tree. And let BM have an extra 5-10 points. No more ferocity/cunning/tenacity.
Just pet.
Pets that USED to be ferocity cunning or tenacity would automatically start with there first point into the 3 skills, leech/movement/hp buff.
That way you can build them however you like.

Tahchi wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 4:57 pm - The ability to (re)spec their pets. The other hunter specs would not be able to do this.

I would genuinely quit over this, to the point I'd force a chargeback to get my money back for Dragonflight over it, even if it bans my account.

No offense. Lol.

I hate not being able to use the pet I want to because it's Tenacity, and I shouldn't have to be BM to do that.