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I've played my hunter for at least 4 years now and I thought I was doing pretty well. I research where I know to research and do what I can to upgrade my gear/etc.

Today people I have known for awhile pointed out I may not really know much after all. So in an effort to try to fix my possible problems, I come to you guys for help.

Question 1: I was under the impression that for 10man lvl 83 bosses you only had to have a 263 hit rating to be hit capped using a 2h weapon, Surv spec, not having that 3% BM skill. My people told me today that I was wrong, that you need something like 16% instead of the 8% I thought it was. Am I wrong?

Question 2: Is there a cap on agi? I gear and gem and enchant to get my 8% hit and then I stuff as much agi in as possible. Is there a point where I need to look into anything other than hit and then agi?

Question 3: I keep seeing people talking about "The Spreadsheet". Is there one place to find this? Is this something that is at multiple places and differs at the different places? When I ask about sites, if answers could be a bit specific it would help. I've been sent to Elitist Jerks before and cannot find anything of what I'm looking for.

Question 4: In the attempt to better myself I want to look at some really well geared/specced/gemmed hunters on the armory. I'm on a pretty fail server and would like to know if anyone has any suggestions as to who to look at for Surv first and MM secondly. Preferably hunters in guilds that are doing 10-25 man newer instances.

Question 5: Is there a definitive site, or at least highly suggested ones, that list "the best shot rotation" or anything like that? I apparently was using a slightly outdated one and not optimizing my dps.

I don't want to be a huntard. I want to make people proud to be a hunter. But as there's only 1 other hunter that I know and he didn't know some basics when I asked, I don't know who to talk to.

My hunter http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... ne&cn=Troo Based on suggestions by my friends I will be regemming her tomorrow for more agi and ignoring most the socket bonuses except for where they are beneficial. If anyone has any constructive help for me, I'd really appreciate it. Please and thank you.

I'm not the greatest hunter out there by any means, far from it, so i don't think i can really help you. but dude, i'd kill to have what you have

I'm not saying I don't appreciate what I've acquired on my hunter, but I'm afraid I'm not using it well. I'm going all out in 10man ICC with my 4867 gear score against guildies with mostly 5000 or more, they're all pulling in 4k dps and I'm struggling to maintain 3k. I thought I was doing well til tonight. I'm usually top dps in any 5 man I do by quite a bit.. then to find out something's wrong..

1. First of all, I can tell you that to be hit capped, you need to have 263 hit rating, wich is 8%. If people tell you that you NEED more, tell them that they're wrong.

2. There's no cap for agility. The more you gem for Agility, the more you'll do dps. Agility is the best for Surv.

3. I have no idea what you're talking about ^_^'' Never heard of it!

4. Feel free to look at my armory if ya want. (I havent replaced so gems yet, but I'm just waiting for gear to drop)

5. Well there's Maxdps...something like that...but my rotation for Surv is: Kill shot (when you can use it) > Explosive shot > Black arrow > Aimed shot > Serpent sting > and fill CDs with Steady shot.

Also...You shouldn't gem for crit. Agility gives you crit. gem with +20 agility gems. I saw that you gemmed your Chest piece with expertise...You have to change that. Hunters don't need expertise. And your talent tree looks ok to me

See, you're mostly fine! Non hunters don't know how to equip hunters.

Koona wrote:1. First of all, I can tell you that to be hit capped, you need to have 263 hit rating, which is 8%. If people tell you that you NEED more, tell them that they're wrong.

I tried to politely say so, but no one believed me. I'm just gonna to on knowing I'm right about this and gemming around a 263/264 hit rating. Thank you for making me sure I wasn't crazy.

Koona wrote:2. There's no cap for agility. The more you gem for Agility, the more you'll do dps. Agility is the best for Surv.

Cool beans.

Koona wrote:4. Feel free to look at my armory if ya want. (I havent replaced so gems yet, but I'm just waiting for gear to drop)
5. Well there's Maxdps...something like that...but my rotation for Surv is: Kill shot (when you can use it) > Explosive shot > Black arrow > Aimed shot > Serpent sting > and fill CDs with Steady shot.

Thank you muchly, tomorrow I shall when I sit down to rework my character. And I thought that was basically what I'd been finding in what I was reading. Gonna have to sit down on a test dummy tomorrow and see if I can get it going for me.

Koona wrote:Also...You shouldn't gem for crit. Agility gives you crit. gem with +20 agility gems. I saw that you gemmed your Chest piece with expertise...You have to change that. Hunters don't need expertise. And your talent tree looks ok to me

Ack. Pretend you didn't see that on my chest piece. That was a mistake when I tossed a gem in there yesterday. Evidently cut the wrong one and didn't notice. Thanks for pointing that out. I was too focused on socket bonuses when I gemmed her up the first time. Thus the mistakes I have going for me atm.

Kayb wrote:See, you're mostly fine! Non hunters don't know how to equip hunters.

Awww. Kind words. I appreciate them after the night I had. Thank you.

YW

I agree with everything Koona has said. Except...

Koona wrote:5. Well there's Maxdps...something like that...but my rotation for Surv is: Kill shot (when you can use it) > Explosive shot > Black arrow > Aimed shot > Serpent sting > and fill CDs with Steady shot.

I do this exact same rotation, except I prioritize Black Arrow before Explosive shot, because while it is active on your target, it increases all dmg done to them by 6%, plus you have a chance of getting a Lock and Load proc before hitting your Explosive shot.

If you want to check out my armory, feel free. I'm not the most well geared player out there, but I have run the first wing of ICC 10 a few times, and bits of ICC 25.

I also give the nod to femaledwarf.com. It's very easy to use and well laid-out, and you can easily import your spec, gear, and pet from the official Armory (so long as that site's up and not down for maintenance), then make changes and see how those changes affect your DPS before making a major commitment.

Though there is one thing to bear in mind looking at a spreadsheet. The DPS totals it gives you are for a single-target fight in a sort of "laboratory" environment (a certain set latency unless you change that value, no movement in the fight, a set fight duration, etc.). I've read that if you can do in the "real world" about 70% of the DPS that femaledwarf shows for your spec and gear, then you've got it about right. I'm not absolutely sure that 70% figure is actually correct, though, so you might want to do a little looking around and see if maybe you can find another citation for that.

Troo wrote:Question 1: I was under the impression that for 10man lvl 83 bosses you only had to have a 263 hit rating to be hit capped using a 2h weapon, Surv spec, not having that 3% BM skill. My people told me today that I was wrong, that you need something like 16% instead of the 8% I thought it was. Am I wrong?

16% is the caster hit cap.

Hunters are not casters.

Dunno who told you that little gem, but they must never have played a physical dps class.

Most everything else has already been covered. No need for expertise ever...you pretty much only need to gem agi and agi/crit; with time, you'll learn which of the blue socket bonuses you don't need and which one you do and can stick a nightmare tear in.

I think you're off to a pretty good start. You gemmed your belt in such a way as to active the socket bonus (and I've seen JC hunters not do this....don't ask, cause I don't even know what they were thinking). ^_^

Haha, I have a rl friend who played a lock to 80. He raided a bit with it, and started a Rogue. When he reached 80 he got gear. He was so proud a month later, he had finally reached his cap. Went to armory. 16% hit rating.

We had a good laugh, and then told him why.

Saturo wrote:Haha, I have a rl friend who played a lock to 80. He raided a bit with it, and started a Rogue. When he reached 80 he got gear. He was so proud a month later, he had finally reached his cap. Went to armory. 16% hit rating.

We had a good laugh, and then told him why.

At least on a rogue, it's less bad, since there's the poison hit cap, which IS higher than 8%.

Oh, as for good hunter armories to check out, this guy right here is my guild's best hunter. The guy is a min-maxing fiend and I go to him for hunterly advice even more than EJ at times. He can do more with lesser gear than any other hunter I know. He's my best possible example of a raiding hunter. ^_^

Troo wrote:I've played my hunter for at least 4 years now and I thought I was doing pretty well. I research where I know to research and do what I can to upgrade my gear/etc.

Today people I have known for awhile pointed out I may not really know much after all. So in an effort to try to fix my possible problems, I come to you guys for help.

Question 1: I was under the impression that for 10man lvl 83 bosses you only had to have a 263 hit rating to be hit capped using a 2h weapon, Surv spec, not having that 3% BM skill. My people told me today that I was wrong, that you need something like 16% instead of the 8% I thought it was. Am I wrong?

Question 2: Is there a cap on agi? I gear and gem and enchant to get my 8% hit and then I stuff as much agi in as possible. Is there a point where I need to look into anything other than hit and then agi?

Question 3: I keep seeing people talking about "The Spreadsheet". Is there one place to find this? Is this something that is at multiple places and differs at the different places? When I ask about sites, if answers could be a bit specific it would help. I've been sent to Elitist Jerks before and cannot find anything of what I'm looking for.

Question 4: In the attempt to better myself I want to look at some really well geared/specced/gemmed hunters on the armory. I'm on a pretty fail server and would like to know if anyone has any suggestions as to who to look at for Surv first and MM secondly. Preferably hunters in guilds that are doing 10-25 man newer instances.

Question 5: Is there a definitive site, or at least highly suggested ones, that list "the best shot rotation" or anything like that? I apparently was using a slightly outdated one and not optimizing my dps.

I don't want to be a huntard. I want to make people proud to be a hunter. But as there's only 1 other hunter that I know and he didn't know some basics when I asked, I don't know who to talk to.

My hunter http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... ne&cn=Troo Based on suggestions by my friends I will be regemming her tomorrow for more agi and ignoring most the socket bonuses except for where they are beneficial. If anyone has any constructive help for me, I'd really appreciate it. Please and thank you.

Alright. Here we go!

Question 1: Your friends are wrong.

Question 2: Agi gems (delicate cardinal rubies +20) are your safest bet for right now. Use them in all sockets regardless of socket bonus unless you just have to have it. For yellows use Deadly Ametrines (+10agi/crit) and pick one token blue for a Nightmare Tear (+10 all stats). Your meta should be Relentless Earthseige and the Nightmare takes care of that on its own.

Question 3: Go to http://www.femaledwarf.com - I promise its not dwarf-porn. Someone truly awesome has taken "the spreadsheet" and made a webpage interface, so that nubs like you and me can import our armory (one step adds everything that is you to the spreadsheet) and calculates your stats (including hit/crit/arp). This is the best place to hit for ANY question you may have had about gear, talents or otherwise. Change one thing and then recalculate DPS. Better or worse? You decide.

Question 4: Go to http://www.worldoflogs.com - I promise its not tree-porn. Kinda explore this site for fun to see what kind of dps people of different specs are able to pull. If you go to "Rankings", choose "DPS" and then your favorite Raid, you'll be able to browse through the top dpsers in the world. Look further into each persons contributions and see what skills they used most. THEN, for added flavor, write down that persons name, guild and server, then look them up on WoW armory or http://www.wow-heroes.com to see what they do differently equipment/gem/talent-wise.

Question 5: I believe the elitistjerk site has the best info on rotations, but I've seen similar "Marksman guides" and the like on the forum at http://www.mmo-champion.com - which you should have set as your homepage anyhow ^^. With so many fights that involve movement and switching to adds, the idea of a "shot priority" overshadows a set rotation but knowing which shots/abilities to keep on constant cooldown really helps.

If you are just starting out with gear and want to be competitive, the best place to start is probably survival spec. Later on, once you are geared out with 232 gear/weps and have a trinket called Needle Encrusted Scorpion (from H FoS), you might try out Marksman for an Armor Penetration build. If you go into the "marksman questions" post on the EJ forums, you'll find lots of info about this build and how to take best advantage of it.

I have 8% hit and, according to recount, I never miss. Any more questions?

Troo wrote: Question 1: I was under the impression that for 10man lvl 83 bosses you only had to have a 263 hit rating to be hit capped using a 2h weapon, Surv spec, not having that 3% BM skill. My people told me today that I was wrong, that you need something like 16% instead of the 8% I thought it was. Am I wrong?

Pretty much everyone else has ansered your other questions much better than I ever could, but one thing has sorta been bugging me here, the "hit capped using a 2h weapon" part.

Whist it is true that when you dual wield, you need more hit to reach the cap... In melee only. What type of melee weapons you use will not affect how much hit you need to never miss with your ranged weapon.

Of course I could be misreading that and your intent was to say that if you want to do teh leet deeps, you can only use a 2h weapon. In that case it's really a matter of what's the better upgrade. I'm pretty sure that yes, the best-in-slot melee item for a hunter is a 2 hander, but if you have the chance to upgrade your weapons to something better, then do it. I myself have only just replaced my two weapons with a nice staff (although my loot luck is horrible, so I may not be the best example here lol). The only problem is that getting two 1h weapons is a bit harder than one 2h weapon.

Moonlost wrote:Pretty much everyone else has ansered your other questions much better than I ever could, but one thing has sorta been bugging me here, the "hit capped using a 2h weapon" part.

In my basic research I'd read that dual wielding needed more, and it didn't specify that that was for melee where I'd seen it. So I was under that impression. I appreciate you explaining that.

Also... thank all of you so much for all of the help and info. I hate not having in game hunters to discuss with, you never see them anywhere other than Dalaran anymore on my server. Here's hoping I can make the most of my hunter with what all you guys gave me.

One more thing - 2Handed weapons and Dual Wielding require the same 8% hit cap to hit with your ranged weapon. If you are meleeing enough to worry about melee dps at this stage, we have something to worry about.

The only reason to go 2H over DW anyhow is because Blizzards itemization for 1h and 2h weapons of the same level are boned. You get more overall stats out of one 2H then DW two 1H weps.

See examples
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47884
vs
DW http://www.wowhead.com/?item=50191

Its actually kind of disturbing since you have to go to more effort for two 1H over just one drop of a 2H. I didn't know this when I was farming dual nighttimes or I might have geared towards using Orca instead (even so, its got too much +hit for my taste). I'll probably just end up with a Quel soon to fix this.