End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Silivren » Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:20 am

Lotusii wrote:I don't even play WoW anymore aside from random logging on to chat while I wait for SWTOR but when I saw this linked here I had to watch it and I really wish I didn't. It's just so disappointing that they decided to kill off the dragon aspects for no seemingly good reason at all. Their job is done? Really? It certainly doesn't seem that way to me. I know it's Blizz's game and they can do whatever they want but I still can't help but feel this ending was just plain bad. I have no problem with Thrall and Aggra being focused on since Thrall is a very important character but even the cinematic itself didn't seem like a very good quality one.

Oh well. It's just a game after all.

This but imo Thrall and Aggra have gotten way too much spotlight and it keeps going on and on... Its kind of sad imo they could have featured others... :?

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by pengupuff » Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:17 am

The ending was a little lackluster for my tastes, but I liked it overall and I think it did a good job of wrapping everything up. It's cool that Thrall will be a daddy. I can only imagine what his son/daughter will go on to achieve. :]

The whole "Age of mortals" deal seems to be a rip from Lord of the Rings, but that is probably not intentional.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by KutiePi » Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:51 pm

To the rude list of items;
WOW. I mean I'm no fan of orcs, when I first joined this game before they added blood elves I made all but the orc race. But I hated them not because of the BAD GRAPHICS in which the males looked like muscle cubes and the females looked proportioned but because I thought them to be savages from the small tibits of lore I was exposed to. But as I learned more and more about the race it became clear that the savagery existed in all races and that orcs are strong, brave and an amazing race. Yes this is a fantasy world but much good could be done from learning from them even in real life. To have pride in yourself and no matter how far you fall to get up and always remember you can make with utter willpower whatever life you want. And seriously hating orcs just because of the way they were made to look is just shallow, and silly. What if we made them look sleek less "ape/monkey" like maybe like the OTHER deformed races you'd like them? None of the other races graphics are good either they all have their faults so hating an entire race because some game company didn't have the tech to make better models or chose not to is like hating the person a statue is of because the artist didn't carve him right. Also let Thrall have his time in the limelight. At least its over now and someone else will get the spotlight.

And about the spoiler; (contains spoilers)
So I quit wow about a month ago with my husband because we're both huge lore fans and felt that at this time the lore was kind of jumping the track now. Yes it answered a lot of the questions we had and some of it was amazing but over all it felt like blizzard was writing themselves into a corner. And also they were basically throwing away a lot of the things they've said before and acting like it never existed. But now the Aspects are going to become mortals????? And the reasons why are just...so so so bad.

One - Their power ran out.
Yes the Titans aren't around anymore and haven't been for a while but the Aspects themselves draw from both the Titans and also the Aspects that they are in charge of. By saying they ran out of power that's like saying they ran out of life, time, dreams, and magic. And as for the Titans being gone apparently you can still get their power again if the moons align just right... >.> Makes sense. But you see where I'm going with this? If the Titans being gone is an issue for how much power reserve an Aspect has then it should have diminished greatly before this point as the dragons had used a ton of it before in previous battles as well. Also the making of a new Aspect should have been impossible but it wasn't. So I can't accept that as a reason. You may respectfully disagree.

Two - (and personally the most heinous) Their job is done.
No. It. Is. Not. Not even close. Their job is to be wardens. They were given their powers to protect the life on that world, and to make sure that the old gods don't burst out of their prisons. Which they've done a great job at that. We haven't even seen all the old gods yet and apparently everything that has happened up until now is all their doing. Yes an old god was responsible for Deathwing but who knows how its all connected. I mean apparently their corpses can still talk to people and grant them powers(cho'gal) and we know there is one in Trisfal. And also demons... most of them were vanquished true but demons have a very nasty way of coming back. Same with the scourge which if I'm not mistaken the cult of the damned kind of have decided to take matters into their own hands now that their king has been replaced.

Overall;
I feel personally that this is the beginning of the end of the great and wonderful story that warcraft has built for us. Maybe and hopefully I am very wrong that this is just a little thing tucked away so they can bring something even better out. I do think Norz become the leader because when faced with his mortality after seeing all time, one might go a bit crazy. And pandas can be salvaged despite all the talk about blizzard saying they were just a joke. As for the gameplay, well it's seen a lot of changes over the years and despite all the complaints and mistakes, well that's how one learns which things to keep and which to trash eh? Its only been getting better.

So feel free to argue my points and disagree, I hope you do. But please be respectful in doing so.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Moderator » Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:14 pm

Moderation note (in case you missed it on the post in question):

We've sent the author a PM about this as well, but the disrespectful language in Kikanu's post is over the line. The post itself has been left because we were having trouble summing up the overall effect in a way that would be helpful to others as an example of over the line.

Responses to the post without other content were deleted.

Now we will drop discussion of Kikanu's post and go back to the main topic.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by GormanGhaste » Sat Dec 03, 2011 5:14 pm

pengupuff wrote:The whole "Age of mortals" deal seems to be a rip from Lord of the Rings, but that is probably not intentional.
I think the whole "elder races leaving the world to mortals" meme has been around a long time. It's used when you're trying to connect stories of a distant age to the present. I would think a more appropriate time to use it in WoW would be, not at the end of an expansion, but at the end of the whole Game, just before they turn out the lights and go home.
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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by cowmuflage » Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:15 pm

GormanGhaste wrote:
pengupuff wrote:The whole "Age of mortals" deal seems to be a rip from Lord of the Rings, but that is probably not intentional.
I think the whole "elder races leaving the world to mortals" meme has been around a long time. It's used when you're trying to connect stories of a distant age to the present. I would think a more appropriate time to use it in WoW would be, not at the end of an expansion, but at the end of the whole Game, just before they turn out the lights and go home.
I would'nt call it a rip from LOTR's seeing as the "age of mortals" things been around since humans began thinking about gods! I mean greek stuffs full of that.

Anyway I kind of get where they are going with this as power corrupts no matter how well you use it it allways does. Who's to say the other aspects would not go down crazy town? I mean if you look at it 3 of the 5 did! XD.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Kayb » Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:44 pm

imagine if lady lifebinder went evil on us, heh
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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Umbriel of Halaa » Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:13 pm

Ket Shi wrote:Note how Aggra doesn't get any lines besides "being pregnant". /rollseyes
Well...that's kind of her entire purpose in-game, or in the lore at all. To make sure that a character who's an obvious staff favorite reproduces.

Pity. I hoped she'd develop some actual depth. That seems unlikely now.
Kayb wrote:imagine if lady lifebinder went evil on us, heh
Well, she's no longer a demigoddess, so that's one thing.

Still: heaven forbid.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Gimlion » Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:34 pm

Sigrah wrote:
LupisDarkmoon wrote:SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER!!!!


Huh. I'm actually really surprised. I mean, I'm kind of lol'ing that it stars Thrall AGAIN, but the aspects giving up their immortality? That's strange. It seems like it may cause a lot of problems, actually. What happens when the aspects die? That means a lot of new aspects and potentially more corrupt ones. And if there aren't more aspects, then the dragons have the ability to run wild. (Dragons aren't *all* nice, no matter the flight.)
…I get the message, but this seems like it could screw up the world. >.<
Well, they did say their "ancient power had been expended" because they had "fulfilled their purpose". That suggests to me that they knew this fight was coming and that it would be the end of their immortality. As for what happens to the rest of the world, here's a few questions that popped into my head:

- What will happen to the balance of power in the Emerald Dream without Ysera being fully empowered?

- Now that Nozdormu is mortal, how exactly will he gain the ability to cause the events leading up to "End Time"? I guess there's tons of way to explain it, but more fun to wonder :)

- How screwed over does Kalecgos feel right about now?

- How long before the new Lich King goes bonkers and starts a second Scourge with the Red Dragonflight's power no longer paying attention to him?
From what I've read and seen, this is my interpretation of the video, broken into answers to each of these questions.

1) Ysera/Emerald Dream: From what I've understood, Ysera being capable of awakening shows that the Dream is under very strong control at the moment, and with Deathwing and the Firelands being dealt with, the Druids will be able to invest full effort into restoring their Dream to a healthy state.

2) Nozdormu/End Time: I know you said it's more fun to wonder, but I believe that Blizzard has shown us that Timelines are very different within CoT, and we don't just see our Timeline, but alternate Timelines as well. In the End Time reality, Deathwing was not stopped, leading to the maddening of yet ANOTHER Aspect (I would have pulled my hair out, I swear). However, in our timeline, Deathwing is defeated, preventing the loss of Nozdormu's sanity.

3) Kalecgos: Meh, he knew what he was getting into, all that power used to save Azeroth, I'm sure he's rather proud actually.

4) Alexstrasza/Bolvar: I'm not too concerned. Arthas had a long time to be corrupted, and the lust for power and acceptance to put him in the perfect position to become the Bat-Shit Crazy Deathknight he was, Bolvar did not have the time to be corrupted like Arthas, and also has a much stronger will than Arthas. Besides, when Arthas banished Ner'zhul from the Crown and Frostmourne, the only thing that kept the Lich King evil was the already-crazed Arthas, who was slain and taken by his Father, there really shouldn't be a source of Corruption (other than power, which Bolvar has held before to great effect) for Bolvar that would lead to such an assault. Also worth mentioning, the Red Dragonflight still has the power of healing, Alexstrasza just lost her immortality, 'tis all.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Lisaara » Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:04 am

Gim, thats probably the best comment I've read so far.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Ikutai » Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:36 pm

As an Official Nozdormu fanboy, I was incredibly saddened by the ending. It was especially emotional to see Noz standing there watching the sands of time run through his hands, with the full knowledge that he was now mortal. That one really ate at me.

Overall, with the Dragon Aspects being mortal, the complete destruction/extinction of the Black, Infinite, and Twilight Dragonflights, it seems this is the seeming wrap-up to the story of the Dragonflights. I'm sure in the future we'll still encounter them (Blue, Bronze, Green, Red), but as major lore characters, I think their time is done.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Lisaara » Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:25 pm

Ikutai wrote:As an Official Nozdormu fanboy, I was incredibly saddened by the ending. It was especially emotional to see Noz standing there watching the sands of time run through his hands, with the full knowledge that he was now mortal. That one really ate at me.

Overall, with the Dragon Aspects being mortal, the complete destruction/extinction of the Black, Infinite, and Twilight Dragonflights, it seems this is the seeming wrap-up to the story of the Dragonflights. I'm sure in the future we'll still encounter them (Blue, Bronze, Green, Red), but as major lore characters, I think their time is done.
I agree.

Also there's a short story: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/lore/s ... 1#readmode

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!)

Unread post by Azunara » Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:32 pm

Jessibelle wrote:
Ikutai wrote:As an Official Nozdormu fanboy, I was incredibly saddened by the ending. It was especially emotional to see Noz standing there watching the sands of time run through his hands, with the full knowledge that he was now mortal. That one really ate at me.

Overall, with the Dragon Aspects being mortal, the complete destruction/extinction of the Black, Infinite, and Twilight Dragonflights, it seems this is the seeming wrap-up to the story of the Dragonflights. I'm sure in the future we'll still encounter them (Blue, Bronze, Green, Red), but as major lore characters, I think their time is done.
I agree.

Also there's a short story: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/lore/s ... 1#readmode
...Dragons. Eee. <3

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Lisaara » Wed Dec 07, 2011 1:15 am

Yush. Dragon story FTW.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Makoes » Wed Dec 07, 2011 3:58 am

I started to cry when Noz held out his hand and watched the sand from his hourglass run through his fingers. I dont really know much about the lore, but for some reason Noz has always been my favourite of the dragon aspects, maybe because he knew the future, and had to let it play out as it did. To have that much power and not try to change things...and the infinite dragon flight, the fight with Murozond...I love that fight but hate having to kill him.

The dragon aspects giving up thier immortality surprised me, and yet it opens up a whole new set of possibilities. Though we also know in the next expansion that the focus between alliance/horde will be more so... But it also hinted during the elemental quest chain that thrall wants peace so much, I cant help but wonder how that will play into things...

I do wonder what became of the corrupted flights, and who the new black dragon leader is...

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Zuilu » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm

I..I've got nothing good to say about this cinematic.
Alright, I lied, one good thing: Nozdormu's shoulders cracking and the sand spilling out. That was a nice touch.

This would have been half decent if Thrall and Aggra weren't stuck in the middle of the plotline again. Blizzard has tried so hard to make Aggra 'beautiful' that it really makes me cringe to look at her face. Thrall's time is beyond up, he's been overused so often in Cata that I can't stand to look or read about him- which is shocking, as he was a long time favourite character of mine from Warcraft 3.

I'm usually really supportive of Blizzard's storylines and lore since I'm an avid RPer, but my god someone needs to tell Metzen to CALM DOWN ON THRALL. Thrall has turned into Metzen's orc-jesus-baby and it's terrible.

I'm excited for MoP but I'm dreading having yet another story of them played out as we see their child born..
Calling it ahead of time, their kid is going to be the most powerful shaman in the world/embody an element/save the world.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Kayb » Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:02 pm

ROFLOL, the amount of crying about who has time in the spot light or not makes me laugh. Instead of people being happy some that decent story telling was done for the first time in far too long, everyone wants to rip it down. It doesn't matter that it was Thrall. If the whole thing had been centered around Magni, or Velen, or Baine, or Varian, or Marsupilami, or Papa Smurf, the same result would have occurred. People would cry about it.

Big bloody whoop people, Thrall got it this time, someone else will get it next time.
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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Kalliope » Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:24 pm

Heh, I ended up giving up on actually seeing this in game, since someone ALWAYS loots the cache before it starts. >_<

Considering the mechanics of the fight, how each aspect's power is gone after you defend their platform, this is a fitting conclusion that makes sense. It's only fair to have a horde-featuring end game cinematic after alliance got the Wrath one.

Aggra has been a Mary Sue from the beginning; I'm not surprised she had no dialogue. Aside from getting Thrall back on track, she really isn't that important a character in the great scheme of things. I'm sure after she gives birth to a baby or two, she'll end up in peril/dead, since she'll have served her purpose and it'll deepen Thrall's character again.

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Umbriel of Halaa » Fri Dec 09, 2011 7:06 pm

Kalliope wrote:Aggra has been a Mary Sue from the beginning; I'm not surprised she had no dialogue. Aside from getting Thrall back on track, she really isn't that important a character in the great scheme of things. I'm sure after she gives birth to a baby or two, she'll end up in peril/dead, since she'll have served her purpose and it'll deepen Thrall's character again.
I agree with everything here except for the classification of Aggra as a "Mary Sue." I'm afraid she'd need to be a distinct character to be a Sue.

And she's not. She's...I ain't gonna say exactly what I'm thinking, but she's just an extension of Thrall. (Oh, sorry, I meant Go'el.)

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Re: End Game Cinematic(SPOILERS!!!!) + Short Story

Unread post by Kalliope » Fri Dec 09, 2011 7:15 pm

Umbriel of Halaa wrote:
Kalliope wrote:Aggra has been a Mary Sue from the beginning; I'm not surprised she had no dialogue. Aside from getting Thrall back on track, she really isn't that important a character in the great scheme of things. I'm sure after she gives birth to a baby or two, she'll end up in peril/dead, since she'll have served her purpose and it'll deepen Thrall's character again.
I agree with everything here except for the classification of Aggra as a "Mary Sue." I'm afraid she'd need to be a distinct character to be a Sue.

And she's not. She's...I ain't gonna say exactly what I'm thinking, but she's just an extension of Thrall. (Oh, sorry, I meant Go'el.)
Fair point. :) She's a nonfactor.

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