Running and raiding as a Beast Master

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Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Shade » Tue Jul 05, 2011 6:45 pm

So I am going to firmly plant my feet and say it. I don't want to learn how to play MM or SV again. I LIKE playing as a BM and in the FL runs I've done so far, I'm usually in the top four of DPS in the group, sometimes even top two (though mages tend to outdo me).

But I want to be a competent raider as a BM, so I think I need to look at my stable and see about what buffs I should start to bring with me. I usually have a devilsaur, spirit beast and corehound that I use in raids-usually the devilsaur as priority-but I am wondering what buffs I should get to better help out.

My stable is as follows:

Ferocity:
Hel (Snarler-wolf) Was my core raiding companion back in WOTLK when I raided as a MM, and I'll never part with him.
Gojira (King Krush-devilsaur): Who has quickly become my core instance/raid partner these days. Almost always have him in my active five.
Baskerville (Chromaggus-corehound): My second core raid/instance companion. Almost always have him in my active five.

Cats:
Acheron (Sambas): Love this cat!
Bast (hunched tiger) and Kage (hunched panther): Attached to both, though I don't tend to have them out a lot these days.
Tybalt (white lion): Remnant from when this toon was a Horde and tamed him off of that quest. Cannot bear to part with him either.

Spirit Beasts:
Faí (Loque'nahak): the pet I am most attached to in game. He is the reason I made my first toon a hunter and the reason I almost entierly play as a BM. Always have him in my active five.
Hatsu (Ban'thalos): I didn't think I would like this guy, but the wings... so mesmerizing. I can't seem to not keep him as my active when I am sitting and waiting for an instance or working on Archaeology. He is too much fun. Almost always have him in my active five.
Marrok (Karoma) and Fenrir (Skoll): Love both of these guys and cannot part with them.
Tyr (Gondria), Zhao (Magria) and Tsume (Ankah): The triplets! I never really use any but Tsume (who is also a rp reference for me), but I would hate to give up the other two.
Saga (Ghostcrawler) and Heimdal (Articus): Honestly have no attachment to them other then they complete the set in my stables...

Tenacity:
Kismet (Jadefang-shale spider): My Squee Buddy! Almost always have him in my active five.
Ragnaroc (Terrorpene-turtle): my alternate tanking pet, if I'm not using the squee for some odd reason.
Requiem (Gorebite-purple cata croc): Tamed due to uniqueness, would not like to release because it would be very difficult to replace. I use a white croc a lot on my lowbie hunters, so I keep this guy as a nod to that.
Pendragon (Black warpstalker): Love warpstalkers, though they are not that grand as tanks, I do enjoy using this guy.
Cryptid (Blue Madexx-scorpion): Has not been used that much since I got my squee buddy.

Cunning:
Jitterbug (blue silthid drone): My dancing buddy. Usually have with my active five if I am thinking of a rare to tame, as he is easily replaceable. I always go back and replace if I release, as he is too much fun.
Pyrotechnic (Red lava spider): Very fun spider, though I don't use that often. Would replace with Deth if possible otherwise will keep.
Mayday (Brilliant Macaw-bird of prey): Originally went after thinking I would use. I now never use this guy but every time I pull out to release-I spent about 60 runs trying to find this guy. I just can't let go after all that work.
Cique (Blue Dragonhawk): I've never actually used this guy-could bear to part with him I think.


-------------

I'm not horribly attached to my Gondria, Brillant Macaw, Dragonhawk, Croc, Ghostcrawler, Articus, or Madexx.

What pet family buffs are best for using as a BM in a raid? I'm looking to maybe decide on letting go a few of the pets listed below and getting something that would be useful the most in a raid. So what are the top raid BM pets, or what would you recommend?

And after all the work it took to get all the Spirit Beasts, should I really make myself get rid of the ones I am not attached to? Gondria and Articus are already on my level 77 hunter, so its not like I wouldn't have them at all if I got rid of them here...

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Re: Running as a Beast Master

Unread post by dayseeder » Tue Jul 05, 2011 6:55 pm

As BM you're going to want to stick with Ferocity pets, but aside from that it depends entirely on your raid comp. I'd recommend: 1) Cat/Spirit Beast (Agi/Str), 2) Wolf/Devilsaur/Hydra (Crit), 3) Raptor (Sunder) and then 4) Hyena (Bleeds), in approximately that order. Just take the one that other classes in your group aren't covering.

Edit: Regarding Spirit Beasts, I have at some point owned all of them save Ankha and Ghostcrawler. At this point I only still own Atlaua (Loque), Alerion (Ban'thalos), Dukujin (Karoma) and Thetis (Magria). I never clicked with the others, and I only use Attie and Ale anyway! Remember that if you do end up releasing one and regretting it, and GM can and will restore him for you.
Last edited by dayseeder on Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Kurenio » Tue Jul 05, 2011 6:59 pm

For BM

1. Spirit beast
2. Devilsaur
3. Corehound
4. Raptor
5. Chimaera (for AoE fights)

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by dayseeder » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:01 pm

Oops, good catch, Kurenio. I main-spec MM so I forgot about the Corehound. (: Absolutely necessary if your group lacks Bloodlust/Time Warp, you can whip him out, cast it, and take out your buff pet again.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Shade » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:03 pm

dayseeder wrote:As BM you're going to want to stick with Ferocity pets, but aside from that it depends entirely on your raid comp. I'd recommend: 1) Cat/Spirit Beast (Agi/Str), 2) Wolf/Devilsaur/Hydra (Crit), 3) Raptor (Sunder) and then 4) Hyena (Bleeds), in approximately that order. Just take the one that other classes in your group aren't covering.

Edit: Regarding Spirit Beasts, I have at some point owned all of them save Ankha and Ghostcrawler. At this point I only still own Atlaua (Loque), Alerion (Ban'thalos), Dukujin (Karoma) and Thetis (Magria). I never clicked with the others, and I only use Attie and Ale anyway! Remember that if you do end up releasing one and regretting it, and GM can and will restore him for you.

I've had a raptor recommended before. Personally I think they are the oddest creature out there and never clicked with one. The hyena recommend is new, I will look into those again.

As to having a GM restore them-I've gone through so many pets, I'll have to make a list of who and when I release them before I do so I think. I tried to get Old Cliff Jumper restored back when it looked like he was out of the game, but the GM couldn't find him in all the pet's I've had, lol.
Kurenio wrote:For BM

1. Spirit beast
2. Devilsaur
3. Corehound
4. Raptor
5. Chimaera (for AoE fights)
A chimera really? I've not used them in a long time, not since my old guild used to get so pissy about them being so big and annoying in a fight.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Kurenio » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:05 pm

Shade wrote: A chimera really? I've not used them in a long time, not since my old guild used to get so pissy about them being so big and annoying in a fight.
Well you can always use a Worm for AoE fights to, but that would make you do alot less single target dps when your doing those parts.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by dayseeder » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:10 pm

Shade wrote:The hyena recommend is new, I will look into those again.
If I recall correctly, the Hyena's debuff, Tendon Rip, is one of the more difficult ones to come by, which is why I added it in there. Ferals, arms warriors, and sub rogues (lolol) can also provide it. It benefits the aforementioned specs, along with fury warriors, the other two rogue specs, and MM hunters. (:

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Shade » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:19 pm

Thank you for the recommendations guys!

I think I am going to bite the bullet and get rid of those three Spirit Beasts I never use-Gondria, Articus and Ghostcrawler. *nod*

Though I am going to note their names and the time just in case I change my mind later on, lol.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Acherontia » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:28 pm

Definitely keep a raptor with you, yeah.

But the choice of pet is easy--the stat priorities/reforging/gemming/enchanting, talents, rotation & glyphs will have more of an impact on your DPS than which Ferocity pet you take, particularly considering that most groups cover most buffs anyway.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Kurenio » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:32 pm

Acherontia wrote:Definitely keep a raptor with you, yeah.

But the choice of pet is easy--the stat priorities/reforging/gemming/enchanting, talents, rotation & glyphs will have more of an impact on your DPS than which Ferocity pet you take, particularly considering that most groups cover most buffs anyway.
This is true BM is probably the most finicky spec when it comes to stats for hunters.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Kalliope » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:33 pm

*late to the party* Raptors bring sunder....most raids already bring that buff. I'd sooner put a ravager/worm in that spot for the physical damage buff, which tends to be the one that's missing in the raids I'm in.

What's your usual raid composition like? What buffs are missing? I'd choose around that.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Acherontia » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:35 pm

Very true, and why RaidChecklist is an excellent addon.

My groups don't normally seem to cover Sunder, though, and it's quite a DPS boost to have along in that case!

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Morven » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:37 pm

Yeah, it really depends what your tank is. Does the Raptor's sunder pull lots of aggro like the warrior's does?

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Shade » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:42 pm

RaidChecklist-I will have to look into that, as I do not have it yet.

I've been pugging mostly so it is a potshot really. I'm still trying to find a guild that is a really good fit for me-right now the one I have found is very competent at raiding, but is so quiet in the guild chat, its not that much different then when I didn't have a guild!

Freed Gondria, Ghostcrawler and the Brilliant Macaw to make room for the three that I am going after.

I'm going to go pick up:

Blue spiny raptor and purple outland chimera.

Should I get a hyena or a ravager for that last spot?

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by dayseeder » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:49 pm

I'd lean towards Hyena, since a Cunning pet is a bigger DPS loss for BM than MM/SV. If I'm wrong, one of you BM diehards please correct me. (:

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Kalliope » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:51 pm

Acherontia wrote:Very true, and why RaidChecklist is an excellent addon.
^^^^
Always have it with me. :)

Ugh, that's a hard choice between those two....If you could give up one more pet for both, that would be ideal. >_>

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Wassa » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:56 pm

For BM, personally, I would go with:

1) Core Hound (bloodlust)
2) Cat/Spirit Beast (agi/str)
3) Wolf/Devilsuar (5% crit)
4) Ravager (inc phy dam)
5) Raptor/Serpent (sunder armor)

I would only go with a hyena if you are marks or have a marks off-spec. The classes with specs that depend on bleed damage the most already have an increased bleed damage debuff.

If you are doing heavy aoe you should probably go survival instead of using a chimaera/worm.

Dragonhawk/wind serpent are other pets to consider with the increased magic damage taken debuff, but they aren't as helpful to BM hunters as they are to our other specs.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by Kurenio » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:58 pm

dayseeder wrote:I'd lean towards Hyena, since a Cunning pet is a bigger DPS loss for BM than MM/SV. If I'm wrong, one of you BM diehards please correct me. (:
You would be correct having a cunning pet is a bigger dps loss to a BM hunter. When it comes to MM/SV is more or less balanced between the 2. Chimaera is the only exception to this since you would be using it for AoE fights and its one of the only AoE pets.

@Wassa

Well she said she wanted to go only BM and not learn SV/MM so a chimaera would be needed for AoE fights.

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by erwil » Tue Jul 05, 2011 7:58 pm

If you don't want to download an addon for raid comp check: http://raidcomp.mmo-champion.com/

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Re: Running and raiding as a Beast Master

Unread post by 7seti » Tue Jul 05, 2011 9:54 pm

I'm going to disagree with the "ferocity-only" advice. As a raiding hunter you should put the success of the raid over your own DPS, which can mean bringing a cunning or tenacity pet to fill a missing buff.

First of all, you should have all the buff/debuff pets that might be needed in a raid in your stable. If there is more than one pet with a buff, get the ferocity one.
-Corehound
-Silithid
-Shale Spider
-Devilsaur/wolf
-Spirit beast/cat
-Raptor
-Hyena
-Ravager
-Windserpent/dragonhawk
-Moth (for interrupts)
-Worm (for AoE)

Before a raid, take a look at what classes you'll be raiding with and adjust your active 5 accordingly.
Got a priest? No need for the silithid.
Got a paladin or druid? Don't need the shale spider.
Got a mage or shaman? Leave the corehound in the stable.
Paladin or DK tank with no rogue? Bring a raptor for sunder armor!

(Dps warriors don't sunder because of the threat it causes, right? Please correct me if I'm wrong!)

----------------------------

AoE fights:
BM is kind of weird when it comes to AoE. It has very poor sustained AoE, but incredible burst if used right. Here's how you do it:

-Launch an explosive trap
-Send in your worm (personally I think worms>chimaeras as they hit a much larger area)
-Start Burrow Attack
-Hit Bestial Wrath
-Spam Multishot until out of focus
-Hit Fervor
-Spam Multishot some more!

-----------------------------------------

When raiding with other hunters, you'll want to discuss which pets to use in order to get the most damage. There is little difference between a cunning pet and a ferocity pet for MM and SV, but BMs definitely wants to use ferocity when they can. As such the buffs from cunning pets are better off coming from a MM or SV hunter.

-------------------------------------

Since you have a spirit beast, you might find this macro useful:

#showtooltip Spirit Mend
/cast [button:2][target=player] Spirit Mend
/cast [button:1][target=focus, exists, nodead],[target=pet, exists, nodead] Spirit Mend

A left-click will cast it on yourself, a right-click will cast on your focus or on your pet if your focus is dead/non-existent. You could also split it into two macros and keybind each, but this saves a bit of keyboard space.

-------------------------------------

Good luck. You'll probably meet a bit of resistance for raiding as BM, but 90% of the time it's completely unjustified.

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