Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#161 Unread post by Lisaara » Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:48 pm

People wouldn't complain if the bag didnt have hard to get mounts. You say its not hard but farming everyday is still work. People care a lot more about mounts than minipets. Thats probably one of the biggest reasons people are complaining. Remove the mounts, replace it with 10 extra valor points.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#162 Unread post by TygerDarkstorm » Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:51 pm

People are complaining for the sake of complaining. No matter what Blizzard does, someone will be there to complain. These mounts are not hard to get. If a DPS can go and solo the place to retrieve the mount, it does not really qualify as "hard to get." The only thing "hard" about these mounts is that they're heavily based on RNG.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#163 Unread post by Vasken » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:01 pm

Jessibelle wrote:People wouldn't complain if the bag didnt have hard to get mounts. You say its not hard but farming everyday is still work. People care a lot more about mounts than minipets. Thats probably one of the biggest reasons people are complaining. Remove the mounts, replace it with 10 extra valor points.
Read the other replies before bringing up the same argument repeatedly.

They're not hard to get. They're easy to farm. If you find Sethekk/Magister's Terrace/Stratholme difficult, then there's probably a few guides in the mount section that'd help! RNG will act upon both the drop rates of these mounts and the bag. Farming the specific dungeons for the mount is far, far, far, far, far, far easier than tanking.

Many tanks don't need VP. Many healers don't need VP. They wouldn't be encouraged to queue. That's been discussed already, it wouldn't work.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#164 Unread post by Lisaara » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:20 pm

Vasken wrote:
Jessibelle wrote:People wouldn't complain if the bag didnt have hard to get mounts. You say its not hard but farming everyday is still work. People care a lot more about mounts than minipets. Thats probably one of the biggest reasons people are complaining. Remove the mounts, replace it with 10 extra valor points.
Read the other replies before bringing up the same argument repeatedly.

They're not hard to get. They're easy to farm. If you find Sethekk/Magister's Terrace/Stratholme difficult, then there's probably a few guides in the mount section that'd help! RNG will act upon both the drop rates of these mounts and the bag. Farming the specific dungeons for the mount is far, far, far, far, far, far easier than tanking.

Many tanks don't need VP. Many healers don't need VP. They wouldn't be encouraged to queue. That's been discussed already, it wouldn't work.
They do if they have a secondary spec. Maybe extra VP and extra JP. People will buy heirlooms for all their toons. I'm sorry but I think you're the one not reading my replies correctly. :) Tyger pointed out the hard part.....the RNG. You're overlooking that. Why should a craptank get Raven Lord when he can't tank to save his life but gets carried by the rest of the group. Meanwhile a good DPS gets Raven Lord through Sethekk Halls cause they worked for it. They did the work aka farm for it.

TLDR; the DPS deserve something if we have to put up with craptanks and crapheals. And don't say the short ques is the reward because you'll be lucky to finish the 'short que dungeon'. I didn't mind waiting 30 mins. It gave me time to repair and go work on something.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#165 Unread post by Purrverted » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:46 pm

Jessibelle wrote: Why should a craptank get Raven Lord when he can't tank to save his life but gets carried by the rest of the group. Meanwhile a good DPS gets Raven Lord through Sethekk Halls cause they worked for it. They did the work aka farm for it.

Crap tank or not...There are way more crap DPS out there. That's why DPS is in queue for so long now... You might get one crap tank, fine. You might get 100 crap tanks. Become the tank and watch how many crap DPS you get in your group. It easily adds up. 1 group=1 tank 1 Healer 3 DPS...What are the odds of crap DPS over a crap tank. Also if the tank is indeed a "Craptank" then how about you use the tool Blizzard put in for when this happens and vote to kick him/her. Or, you can have a heart, help guide the "craptank" and help him understand the viewpoint as a DPS and kindly inform him of things he can improve on so he knows for his next run. Also, are you really worried about what another player may or may not get in their loot bag? I mean really. Is what they get going to somehow pay their IRL bills or put food on his IRL table for his family? NO! Say he gets a mount. big deal. It is a group of pixels. I really don't see why people would care who got what from the damn bag...It's a bag...your day will come. Be happy for him or her and move on imo. Also, I am looking forward to seeing you in a random. Maiev queues up with Moon Gaurd and I am alliance. Will see just how pro you are and just how big of a crap tank I can be. Actually prob not. Cause I don't care that much. I will queue and I will be the best tank I can be and take my bag and loot that mount and ride it till the legs fall off. Oh yeah what are the drop rates of a mount from the bag, does anyone even have an idea...some of you people are complaining like its a promised deal. So again....lets wait till this idea of theirs goes live and see how it is working in the future. Hell, I even bet Blizzard will put some kind of % in there for the call to arms to be w/e. Sure tanks and healers are needed but who says Blizzard wont implement some kind of anti 100% tank/healer call to arms idea. Wouldn't surprise me they limit the amount of times a tank can be a choice for this in the long run.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#166 Unread post by Lisaara » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:51 pm

Purrverted wrote:
Jessibelle wrote: Why should a craptank get Raven Lord when he can't tank to save his life but gets carried by the rest of the group. Meanwhile a good DPS gets Raven Lord through Sethekk Halls cause they worked for it. They did the work aka farm for it.

Crap tank or not...There are way more crap DPS out there. That's why DPS is in queue for so long now... You might get one crap tank, fine. You might get 100 crap tanks. Become the tank and watch how many crap DPS you get in your group. It easily adds up. 1 group=1 tank 1 Healer 3 DPS...What are the odds of crap DPS over a crap tank. Also if the tank is indeed a "Craptank" then how about you use the tool Blizzard put in for when this happens and vote to kick him/her. Or, you can have a heart, help guide the "craptank" and help him understand the viewpoint as a DPS and kindly inform him of things he can improve on so he knows for his next run. Also, are you really worried about what another player may or may not get in their loot bag? I mean really. Is what they get going to somehow pay their IRL bills or put food on his IRL table for his family? NO! Say he gets a mount. big deal. It is a group of pixels. I really don't see why people would care who got what from the damn bag...It's a bag...your day will come. Be happy for him or her and move on imo. Also, I am looking forward to seeing you in a random. Maiev queues up with Moon Gaurd and I am alliance. Will see just how pro you are and just how big of a crap tank I can be. Actually prob not. Cause I don't care that much. I will queue and I will be the best tank I can be and take my bag and loot that mount and ride it till the legs fall off. Oh yeah what are the drop rates of a mount from the bag, does anyone even have an idea...some of you people are complaining like its a promised deal. So again....lets wait till this idea of theirs goes live and see how it is working in the future. Hell, I even bet Blizzard will put some kind of % in there for the call to arms to be w/e. Sure tanks and healers are needed but who says Blizzard wont implement some kind of anti 100% tank/healer call to arms idea. Wouldn't surprise me they limit the amount of times a tank can be a choice for this in the long run.
I'd like to know when you can make a valid argument. One that doesn't involve personally attacking someone or being ridiculously condescending and rude. I'm done. I've stated my point and I know mine is just as valid as anyone elses. I hate being trolled on a forum that didn't used to have trolls.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#167 Unread post by Purrverted » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:58 pm

Jessibelle wrote:
Purrverted wrote:
Jessibelle wrote: Why should a craptank get Raven Lord when he can't tank to save his life but gets carried by the rest of the group. Meanwhile a good DPS gets Raven Lord through Sethekk Halls cause they worked for it. They did the work aka farm for it.

Crap tank or not...There are way more crap DPS out there. That's why DPS is in queue for so long now... You might get one crap tank, fine. You might get 100 crap tanks. Become the tank and watch how many crap DPS you get in your group. It easily adds up. 1 group=1 tank 1 Healer 3 DPS...What are the odds of crap DPS over a crap tank. Also if the tank is indeed a "Craptank" then how about you use the tool Blizzard put in for when this happens and vote to kick him/her. Or, you can have a heart, help guide the "craptank" and help him understand the viewpoint as a DPS and kindly inform him of things he can improve on so he knows for his next run. Also, are you really worried about what another player may or may not get in their loot bag? I mean really. Is what they get going to somehow pay their IRL bills or put food on his IRL table for his family? NO! Say he gets a mount. big deal. It is a group of pixels. I really don't see why people would care who got what from the damn bag...It's a bag...your day will come. Be happy for him or her and move on imo. Also, I am looking forward to seeing you in a random. Maiev queues up with Moon Gaurd and I am alliance. Will see just how pro you are and just how big of a crap tank I can be. Actually prob not. Cause I don't care that much. I will queue and I will be the best tank I can be and take my bag and loot that mount and ride it till the legs fall off. Oh yeah what are the drop rates of a mount from the bag, does anyone even have an idea...some of you people are complaining like its a promised deal. So again....lets wait till this idea of theirs goes live and see how it is working in the future. Hell, I even bet Blizzard will put some kind of % in there for the call to arms to be w/e. Sure tanks and healers are needed but who says Blizzard wont implement some kind of anti 100% tank/healer call to arms idea. Wouldn't surprise me they limit the amount of times a tank can be a choice for this in the long run.
I'd like to know when you can make a valid argument. One that doesn't involve personally attacking someone or being ridiculously condescending and rude. I'm done. I've stated my point and I know mine is just as valid as anyone elses. I hate being trolled on a forum that didn't used to have trolls.


ROFL. Again people are taking this way to seriously. I am not being a troll. My side of this discussion is as valid as yours. Nor did I personally attack you or anyone else on this thread... I simply argued to your "craptank" post. And I said I would like to see how pro you are. Is that rude or ridiculously condescending??

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#168 Unread post by Saturo » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:04 pm

The good thing, Talu, is that he lists his characters in his sig, so if you want to you can just avoid him through that. Either way, I agree, being condescending and rude isn't helping you, or anyone else, in the slightest way.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#169 Unread post by Lisaara » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:07 pm

Saturo wrote:The good thing, Talu, is that he lists his characters in his sig, so if you want to you can just avoid him through that. Either way, I agree, being condescending and rude isn't helping you, or anyone else, in the slightest way.
Planned on putting my ignore list to good use unless they decide to apologize for being nasty throughout this topic. :)

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#170 Unread post by Vasken » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:10 pm

The reading comment was more aimed at everything in general, whoops! Apologies.
...the RNG. You're overlooking that
RNG will act upon both the drop rates of these mounts and the bag.
;)

Couldn't resist, sorry! I might be waving the wrong end of the stick. Know that RNG's a bum, have been grinding the Raven Lord on three alts for almost two years! Think you're in the same boat. :lol:
Why should a craptank get Raven Lord when he can't tank to save his life but gets carried by the rest of the group
Unless the healer's fantastic... It's very difficult to carry an awful tank. Would hope they'd get kicked pretty quickly! If the bag was given to the entire group, then, by the same logic, why should awful DPS get the Raven Lord when they can't DPS to save their lives and get carried? Though, you never know, DPS might be Call to Arms... Eventually! Prefer heroics on my hunter by miles.
They do if they have a secondary spec. Maybe extra VP and extra JP. People will buy heirlooms for all their toons
Many of my friends don't need VP at all. They've got all possible upgrades! It's no use at all to many folk- one of the issues brought up by Blizzard... I think. Recall reading a Blizzpost on MMOchamp! People outgrow gear quickly. And what better way to lure in tanks and healers than to bribe them with a possible mount? Agree that it... Would likely lure in some... Euh... Extremely questionable excuses for healers and tanks, too.

But... Then again... Heirlooms! One can never have enough heirlooms! Would say perhaps a low chance of receiving a +5% exp ring or something, but that'd receive just as many complaints I'd imagine. Can even just restrict it to mini-pets alone, but... Fickle subject is... Fickle! Mini-pets might not be... Enough rewa-... Heck, no clue. It varies so much between people!
TLDR; the DPS deserve something if we have to put up with craptanks and crapheals. And don't say the short ques is the reward because you'll be lucky to finish the 'short que dungeon'. I didn't mind waiting 30 mins. It gave me time to repair and go work on something.
I can only suggest that you try out LFD heroics as a solo tank. We almost always need to put up with horrific and abusive DPS! Your job is so much easier in comparison- that alone is a pretty good reward. Well, to me at least! Opinions vary and I'm sure you'll disagree. Though... Can agree to be worried about the possible influx of awful tanks/healers. While the short queues are usually tempting enough to some, would hate to see how these additional rewards would affect things! Think the first week this is introduced may be... Chaos. Heck, don't think anyone knows how this'll turn out! Think I understand your point however. Whack me with a blunt object if not! :lol:

Will actually be using this more for Vasken than my tank. Screw mounts I'm already farming, shorter queues please! :D
(Or well. Perhaps shorter queues into wipefests in the first few weeks. /cower)

Edit: Sorry if I've missed something, really shouldn't ramble when sleep deprived. Can nod along with everything said though, they're concerns many people likely have! :O
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#171 Unread post by Purrverted » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:21 pm

Sorry just to clarify...Where was I condescending and rude? Also stated before, I am not hear to troll. I also stated in a earlier post that it was not my intentions to upset anyone. So if i did, I did. I won't apologize for having a mind of my own and bringing up questions to questions that we asked on a public forum and to one where I have done nothing wrong. I have gave my opinions just as easily as some of you. You can't read peoples posts and say they are being rude and going to the extreme of putting them on ignore. You can't see my emotions when i type this. So how does it translate that I am being mean and rude? They are my thoughts and ideas as much as you and yours.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#172 Unread post by Saturo » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:22 pm

It's how you come across, regardless of whether you intend it or not.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#173 Unread post by Lisaara » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:28 pm

Naw Vasken....you've been the nicest commenter so far and one of the calmest and it's much appreciated. Sorry if my posts may have come off as grumpy. Haha.

I have healed before....once....I swore I'd never do it again but I may pick it up on Jetfyre. Long story short....7 people, AQ40.....never resto raid healed before. Only advice my horde guild at the time gave me was "Keep your arms up and don't stop." Yeah....it scared the bejabbers outta me.

And trust me, I know DPS can be derpy but I get more retarded Tanks and Healers than DPS. the DPS even know the fights better usually but this shows how everyones luck varies. :) But I know some DPS can be stupid. *cough* Like the rogue that uses his bow....or the hunter that doesnt know what the Trap Launcher is.....or says hunters have no CC.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#174 Unread post by Chimera » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:29 pm

Quote from Purr to Jess: Also, I am looking forward to seeing you in a random. Maiev queues up with Moon Gaurd and I am alliance. Will see just how pro you are and just how big of a crap tank I can be.

-ending quote-

That seems quite rude and to me personally even though its not me who you are saying that to, some form of threat.

Edit: I should of taken this to PM, i apologize for forgetting that option and creating civil unrest. Take it to a PM with me if you wish to further discuss it. I shall take my leave of posting on the thread unless another argument breaks out as a result of my post (sorry >.<) or different posts.
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#175 Unread post by Purrverted » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:35 pm

Xakaal wrote:Quote from Purr to Jess: Also, I am looking forward to seeing you in a random. Maiev queues up with Moon Gaurd and I am alliance. Will see just how pro you are and just how big of a crap tank I can be.

-ending quote-

That seems quite rude and to me personally even though its not me who you are saying that to, some form of threat.

Are you serious? Really? That is not a threat. That is me reading into what she said as craptanks yadda yadda and how she doesnt make mistakes. More like, lets see if you are a good of dps as you say you are. Not that she said that but you can't comment on other peoples roles unless you are solid in your own, and not even then. If it is a craptank, they have to start somewhere and learn how to play as they go. I really do not see that as a threat what so ever. Again some of you are reading my posts wrong. I am the least threatening individual you will ever come across.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#176 Unread post by TygerDarkstorm » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:41 pm

You know why it's so much easier to run into a bad Healer or Tank? It's because there's a lot fewer of them in the group. If they mess up, the group is likely to wipe and their mistakes are much more noticeable. There's 3 DPS in a group, if one, or even two of them, are derpy you're *much* more likely to finish the dungeon.

Tanks and healers take more shit in this game than any of the DPS. It is so bad that I'm literally afraid of the dungeon finder on my tanks because it stresses me out to know that I'll probably get stuck with some jerk who will take everything out on me because I'm not a perfect tank. We tanks have to learn to react to a variety of situations and the DPS mentality of "GOGOGOGOGO" doesn't help.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#177 Unread post by Saturo » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:43 pm

TygerDarkstorm wrote:Tanks and healers take more shit in this game than any of the DPS. It is so bad that I'm literally afraid of the dungeon finder on my tanks because it stresses me out to know that I'll probably get stuck with some jerk who will take everything out on me because I'm not a perfect tank. We tanks have to learn to react to a variety of situations and the DPS mentality of "GOGOGOGOGO" doesn't help.
Exactly. I'd be much more open to tanking if it didn't kick off my anxiety problems.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#178 Unread post by Purrverted » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:44 pm

Actually I am done with this thread and prob the forums here altogether. I can't seem to voice my opinions with out one or more you jumping me and lashing out in my direction over you seeing my posts other than how I meant for them to be. Obviously I fail at voicing my opionions with out stepping one some toes. So, good luck to you all. And yes, again, sorry for those who feel I was rude. I will remember next time I post in future months on other forums to include lil smiley faces and silly things so you know that I am not bashing or being condescending or rude. :) Laters.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#179 Unread post by Chimera » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:44 pm

I edited my post thats above Purr's that has me quoted. That is all for now.

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

#180 Unread post by Lisaara » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:50 pm

Xakaal wrote:I edited my post thats above Purr's that has me quoted. That is all for now.
It's all good. You meant well. It did sound like a threat, imo....and I never said they were a craptank but for some reason they're saying I did. I never called anyone here a craptank last I checked. I just voiced my experiences. I guess they don't know the saying 'It's not what you say, but it's how you say it.' and that plays a major part. Smilies don't make the sentences. The words do. Big difference between "Omg lol you guys are QQing too much. You make me laugh!" and "We really shouldn't judge this before it goes live but I do understand both aspects it could bring."
Saturo wrote:
TygerDarkstorm wrote:Tanks and healers take more shit in this game than any of the DPS. It is so bad that I'm literally afraid of the dungeon finder on my tanks because it stresses me out to know that I'll probably get stuck with some jerk who will take everything out on me because I'm not a perfect tank. We tanks have to learn to react to a variety of situations and the DPS mentality of "GOGOGOGOGO" doesn't help.
Exactly. I'd be much more open to tanking if it didn't kick off my anxiety problems.
Agreed totally. I've tried tanking too and got possibly the most assholish group ever and much like with healing, I swore off tanking. Goodies won't make me come back to it.

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Sig Credits to Ashaine, Kamoodle, Sookie, Kurenio, Serenith, Ket Shi, Nili, Rongar, Britany, TheDoomcookie, Vyndara, and Vephriel!
Avatar Credits to Samskeyti, Moonlost, Lupisdarkmoon, Nili, Britany, Kasstra, Seilahyn, and Vephriel!


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