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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 9:37 pm 
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Illustrious Master Hunter
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I noticed something about paralyzing quill. It's not actually a stun, just an incapacitate - basically an AoE repentance.

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 9:57 pm 
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Kalliope wrote:
I noticed something about paralyzing quill. It's not actually a stun, just an incapacitate - basically an AoE repentance.


That is actually really handy to know, I'm guessing that it means it wont shard diminishing returns from intimidation if spec'ed BM? or any other stuns for that matter.

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 4:08 pm 
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Kalliope wrote:
I noticed something about paralyzing quill. It's not actually a stun, just an incapacitate - basically an AoE repentance.


Glad to know that. I'll make the changes as soon as possible :)
Thanks!

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 9:18 am 
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Thanks for the overview of the pet skills! My old excel was pretty outdated. For me that one is easier to read then a list :) if anyone is interested in the sheet let me know then I will make it accessible on Google docs.

I know there's a addon for ingame to see which buffs you miss in a raid.
But for me personally I am using the sheet to see which pets I can clean out for Wednesday and still have everything covered buff/debuff wise :P

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 9:59 am 
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Malackai wrote:
Thanks for the overview of the pet skills! My old excel was pretty outdated. For me that one is easier to read then a list :) if anyone is interested in the sheet let me know then I will make it accessible on Google docs.

That would be great. I know I looked at my copy periodically throughout Cataclysm.

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:00 pm 
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Expert Hunter
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Here is the googledoc : https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgK6KJogo3wKdGsyV3BFeHlmdkVVNENJTUMxc0pwS0E

edit: i will check tomorrow if i have all skill noted down correctly dont know if wowhead is up to date atm on them (duration/cd wise)

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 5:55 pm 
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Apologies if this is obvious to everyone but am I right in saying we don't have room in our stable to get 1 of every ability and 1 of every exotic pet? I'd planned to do this in order to cover everything I could with whatever spec I play and I'm coming up with 27 abilities (counting the 3 short crowd controls each, because they each work differently).


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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 7:35 pm 
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TobiasX wrote:
Apologies if this is obvious to everyone but am I right in saying we don't have room in our stable to get 1 of every ability and 1 of every exotic pet? I'd planned to do this in order to cover everything I could with whatever spec I play and I'm coming up with 27 abilities (counting the 3 short crowd controls each, because they each work differently).


There will definitely be some redundancies between the pets. Like if you take a quilen for the battle res and a water strider for waterwalking, you'll end up with the crit buff twice on exotic pets.

A handful of pets have redundant abilities in relation to hunter abilities too. Like crocs and warpies with their slows - we have conc shot for that.

It really comes down to picking and choosing what you actually NEED and will use.

I don't believe this had been discussed before. Our options, in becoming more diverse, now mean that we cannot have everything in our stable at once. I rather like that we have to choose.

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:05 pm 
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Thank you very much for making this and all the hard work you've put in. I've been working on my own list for my guild and this helps to cross-check against.

Bravo.


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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:30 am 
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Kalliope wrote:
There will definitely be some redundancies between the pets. Like if you take a quilen for the battle res and a water strider for waterwalking, you'll end up with the crit buff twice on exotic pets.

The problem I have with this is that, while exotic pets have 2 abilities, the only way 1 can be redundant is if another family shares both their abilities. In your case you don't have 2 pets with the crit buff; you have 1 with a battle res and the crit buff & another with the spellpower buff and the crit buff, so I'd want to have both. If I only get 1 I know, at some point, the raid will need the other combination.

Kalliope wrote:
A handful of pets have redundant abilities in relation to hunter abilities too. Like crocs and warpies with their slows - we have conc shot for that.

While this is true to an extent there could be a situation where it needs to be your pet, and not you, that snares the target, so I'd like to be able to tame 1 for that eventuality.
The only pets I consider completely redundant are ones where I already have all raid-related abilities they have covered by another, single, pet. For example: Bears are awesome, but if I already have a Carrion Bird I love I'm not going to get 1 just for Rest (this is actually a lie, I have a Bear instead of a Carrion Bird).

Kalliope wrote:
It really comes down to picking and choosing what you actually NEED and will use.

I need all of them :( as I'd like to be able to cover every need that a group could have of a hunter.

Kalliope wrote:
I don't believe this had been discussed before. Our options, in becoming more diverse, now mean that we cannot have everything in our stable at once. I rather like that we have to choose.

I agree that having to choose between things can be something important to have in the game, but I don't think our stable should be part of that. Deciding what talents to choose for a fight is different to choosing what pet to abandon when you want to have something else for a specific encounter / raid composition.

Apologies if this comes across as rude; I'm frustrated as I like to be as useful as possible to any group I'm part of and 2 stable slots is preventing me from doing that in MoP.


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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 8:02 am 
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TobiasX wrote:
Kalliope wrote:
A handful of pets have redundant abilities in relation to hunter abilities too. Like crocs and warpies with their slows - we have conc shot for that.

While this is true to an extent there could be a situation where it needs to be your pet, and not you, that snares the target, so I'd like to be able to tame 1 for that eventuality.

Kalliope wrote:
It really comes down to picking and choosing what you actually NEED and will use.

I need all of them :( as I'd like to be able to cover every need that a group could have of a hunter.


What I've found is that this sort of mentality ends up being incredibly impractical in practice. Having a pet in your stable on the off chance that you need that obscure ability for one situation ends up not being worth the sacrifice of space. You can only use one type of CC at a time, so effectively, you really only need one (unless you're doing hardcore arena or something and need to swap pets a lot - but again, that's very very niche).

Your theoretical example of needing a pet to snare instead of the hunter sounds incredibly niche. A melee player could do the same job and require no micromanagement. If the situation isn't safe for players, then a ranged slow would be better.

TobiasX wrote:
Apologies if this comes across as rude; I'm frustrated as I like to be as useful as possible to any group I'm part of and 2 stable slots is preventing me from doing that in MoP.


I understand your concern, since I planned my early Cataclysm stable around buffs. For example, I ran with a shale spider for a little while. But I never needed to bring one for a raid, since there was always a druid or paladin (more often both) for the kings buff. I had no real bond with her, so I stopped keeping one in my stable. Haven't missed that buff once.

The most common buffs are going to be covered by other classes in a raid. Everyone brings at least one buff, period. The biggest and most important buffs will be covered already. Hunters may have turned into the utility infielder of the world of buffs, but that does not mean we need to be able to bring everything. A little bit of time spent raiding in early Cata indicated that the physical debuff and bleed debuff were often missing, so I made sure to bring my ravager and raptor to pugs. The same sort of experimentation in MoP will yield similar results - you'll get to know which buffs are always covered by other classes and which aren't.

Exotic pets bring more specialized buffs, so having a more complete complement of those makes some sense. (Noting again that some of the buffs that are so important that they will assuredly be covered by someone else in the raid.) But the non-exotic utility abilities? You don't need all of them. A monkey's CC has the same effect as a crane's. Pets with interrupts are less effective than just speccing for silencing shot, which has a shorter cooldown and which is affected by readiness.

So I'll say it again: you do not need all of the buffs, debuffs, and utility abilities that hunters can bring.

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 7:26 pm 
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For boars
Gore Special Ability
Melee Range
Instant 10 sec cooldown
Your boar gores the enemy, causing it to take 4% increased physical damage for 30 sec.
but for ravages
Ravage Special Ability
Melee Range
Instant 15 sec cooldown
Violently attacks an enemy, causing the enemy target to take 4% increased physical damage for 25 sec.


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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:41 am 
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It seems that Spore Bats bring 5% spell haste in addition of their casting speed reduction. At the moment buff is called Mind Quickening, but it has same wording as Priests Shadowform in spell book.

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 Post subject: Re: MoP Pet Ability List
Unread postPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:22 am 
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Aggannor wrote:
It seems that Spore Bats bring 5% spell haste in addition of their casting speed reduction. At the moment buff is called Mind Quickening, but it has same wording as Priests Shadowform in spell book.


thanks!
Updated the Spreadsheet as well

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