Attn Florida gamers.. bonus rolls now illegal

[Bulletdance]

I likely don't have a good enough grasp on the situation,but to be honest to me it seems like the problem could have been handled by limiting the amount of money people are allowed to spend in such places before it is considered illegal gambling and the establishments could be responsible for keeping track electronically of their clients spending through use of something like ID cards and then have to submit that information to the government. I would love for a law to come in to place to prevent real money gambling through means of games from targeting and advertising to children. Bye bye facebook good riddance, but the fact of the matter is the government is so full of cronies who get paid to do what the big businesses want it's a joke. This though is a trivial thing compared to what else is going on. It's illegal now to go in to places like farms and puppy mills and take footage of animal abuse to show the public and no one seemed to notice. Why? Because the farming industry lobbied for it and won.

Problem is they were getting around the law by offering things like gift cards and the like instead of actual cash prizes. They'd have Walmart or Visa cards that were loaded with X amount of money instead of offering actual money, hence the abuse of the Chuck-E-Cheese law. I can see a person running one of these cafes purchasing a certain number of cards in a certain amount then crying broke or fudging the numbers to make it seem like they aren't making as much as they say they are. I think a tracking system would be nice but in Florida, unless it's one of the riverboat cruises, all gambling is pretty much illegal and how much personal info would be turned over to the people running these places? Believe or not, in the amusement industry, the ratio of honest men to scum is extremely high in favor of the scum.

Oh I believe you they're probably scum,but a law isn't made just to prevent crime. If you make something solid enough so that you can have a proper agency looking in to things and seeing when the law is being broken you can prosecute those taking advantage of people and put them out of business.

[Makoes]

So, why wasn't the law just amended to include Gift cards, credits, etc along with monetary payouts? On top of that, you speak of elderly loosing their money, well, are they being forced to gamble or do they play willingly? Does your government have an education program in place to teach its people about safe gambling/playing, teaching them to play within their limits?

What happened to freedom of rights? Your Government has turned every single person with a device capable of hooking up to the internet into an illegal device...so, tell me are the electronic stores or any place that sells these illegal devices going to be shut down as well for selling gambling equipment? What about the Government offices? They have internet devices, are they going to be arrested for breaking the law? What about police, fire departments, hospitals? don't they need to all be shut down for having these illegal devices? While we're at it lets shut down all the schools to!

This law is so heavily flawed it goes beyond the issue now...

[Irijia]

So, why wasn't the law just amended to include Gift cards, credits, etc along with monetary payouts? On top of that, you speak of elderly loosing their money, well, are they being forced to gamble or do they play willingly? Does your government have an education program in place to teach its people about safe gambling/playing, teaching them to play within their limits?

What happened to freedom of rights? Your Government has turned every single person with a device capable of hooking up to the internet into an illegal device...so, tell me are the electronic stores or any place that sells these illegal devices going to be shut down as well for selling gambling equipment? What about the Government offices? They have internet devices, are they going to be arrested for breaking the law? What about police, fire departments, hospitals? don't they need to all be shut down for having these illegal devices? While we're at it lets shut down all the schools to!

This law is so heavily flawed it goes beyond the issue now...

I decided to jump in here, this is her husband speaking...the one who actually has worked in the local amusement and gaming industry for the last 17 years. People keep seeming to miss the main point here. In Florida, a state where *we* actually live, Gambling is *illegal*. There should not be a responsible gambling education program...because Gambling is *illegal*. That's like asking the state for an educational program showing the proper methods of smoking crack. If you use a device in the state of Florida for the purpose of gambling, then the device can be confiscated. The main difference here is one of "Mallum in se" vs "Mallum prohibitum" (illegal because it is bad in itself, vs illegal because it is prohibited)

Just because the internet allows you to access something, does not mean it is legal or proper for you to do so, for example in the cases of viewing certain types of pornography. Some will (and should) give you a long, extended vacation at the greybar Hilton, depending on where you live. By the same logic, using an ordinary, common, everyday device such as a computer or a cell phone for illegal purposes makes the device illegal. It does not make ALL such devices illegal, merely those used for an illegal purpose. The hospital can keep it's Cat-Scan machine, just as long as the technicians aren't using it to play Blackjack on the side.

Could such a law be abused by the authorities? I imagine so, but this is why we have our judicial system. You can always appeal to a higher court...even fantastically well written laws can be abused, especially if those doing the abusing have less concern with law and more concern with manipulation to their own ends.

I believe that the law has done more good than harm, so far...but it does need to be amended. The illegal gambling casinos (which is what the internet cafe's really were) were nothing but trouble to the local population. Some people enjoyed them, but they were skirting the law through a loophole, and allowed more corruption to slip through our local politics than most people realize. Again, just because you can, does not always mean that you should...much of the internet has this lesson to learn.

[Bulletdance]

If it's doing good that's great more power to it, I just hope they don't go around arresting kids playing the claw game to get stuffed animals And I've been using Petopia for a few years now I don't appreciate you insinuating the good people on here need to learn not to do illegal things just because they can. Everyone has different opinions and I'd just like to take a moment to remind people to keep it civil it's okay to disagree

[Sukurachi]

I'm sorry, but:

Florida Lottery

are some people unclear on the concept of what gambling/gaming is?

Florida Bingo Halls by district

again, more of the same.

A state-run lottery is gambling. To make any sort of moral judgement on the value of gambling while at the same time condoning "state sanctioned" gambling is the height of hypocrisy.

[Irijia]

Who passed moral judgement? Stating what the law is and what the current consequences are for breaking the law is hardly moral judgment. Just because it disagrees with what it should be does not change the fact of what it is. Mallum prohibitum...bad because it is illegal.

I don't deny that this world is full of hypocrisy.

[cowmuflage]

Ironically cow...this isn't the most derp law thats been passed.

Oh XD

[Myrrmi]

(...) The same law that allowed children and other redemption type games in Florida was being purposely exploited in order to drain the elderly of their funds.

There is a massive number of retirees and others on a fixed income who were losing all of their money to these internet cafés. It was so bad that at one point, you had 150-200 machine cafés and they were all over the place. There was also a massive amount of corruption going on around them, my husband personally knows of cafes that were owned by such prominent members of society such as city councilmen, police chiefs and, in one case, the entire fire department of a small town in Florida.

While I agree that the law is too broad, it is far better for the purpose of protecting people than what we had before.

With all due respect, it appears to me that the legislation went very wrong here. It has baned the result of the problem, not it's source. The cheaters will just find another way to cheat, and they will get their share before you put up another law, and then the whole thing will repeat and repeat. Human creativity is infinite, especially of those creative cheater types who are always a step before their lawful pursuiters, and you can't ban EVERYTHING.

What I see as a problem here is the helplessness of the elderly people. I think some kind of an educational programe would be a fitting solution for them. Make it so that they realize which of their strings the cheaters would pull. Teach them a way of thinking to defend themselves against manipulation. It will really do them much good.

Yea, I know it's a big and difficult thing, but otherwise it's just an infinite catch-me-if-you-can kid game.
Besides, human beings are not babies. They have their own free will and the right to bear consequences of their deeds. Both ways.

[Danielfboone]

If my computer is a slot machine how come it never pays off? I think it's rigged.

[Lisaara]

If my computer is a slot machine how come it never pays off? I think it's rigged.

Ikr? I want my payout! XD

[Slickrock]

I'm sorry, but:

Florida Lottery

are some people unclear on the concept of what gambling/gaming is?

Florida Bingo Halls by district

again, more of the same.

A state-run lottery is gambling. To make any sort of moral judgement on the value of gambling while at the same time condoning "state sanctioned" gambling is the height of hypocrisy.

Not to mention native american casinos..


The real issue here is that the Fla legislature came up with a very bad solution to a real problem. The fact that a law to make unregulated video poker halls illegal also makes your computer or smartphone illegal is just absurd.

And yes, from what I can tell from reading more about it, bonus rolls on loot would definitely be illegal, since it is a "game of chance" whose potential value could be higher than the limits allowed, based on the value of loot in games where you can buy it (i.e. Diablo).

[Slickrock]

One other thing here.. while the cafe's were out of hand, guess who was one of the groups supporting the legislation? The owners of the horse tracks.. (not to mention the state lottery).

It's like in CA here, the big backers of the laws that tried to stop indian casinos? Vegas casinos.