A Proposition for Beast Mastery Pets

[lilatha]

Everything you've just explained manipulates our pets in some way or another. Beast Mastery is about our further control and manipulation of our pets. No, SV and MM don't get any of the abilities or advantages you've just mentioned although every one of those benefits our pets. We ourselves don't benefit from Intimidation yet our pet uses it to pull aggro from us and stop our enemies from taking our range away. The 15% AP buff is mainly for our pets as well since AP is one of the stats to scale the best between hunter and pet. The four extra talent points Beast Mastery gives our pets is for our pet. No, Beast Mastery isn't just about the pet but the pet is probably the biggest component of what we do as Beast Masters. SV and MM still have quite a few tricks up their sleeve when their pet dies but a BM hunter is next to nothing without it.

Yeah amazing that Hunters get a pet at lv1 nows! And you can use these attacks with any pet who doesn't need to be all exotic :3

But I still doubt they would just give em to lowbies they would on forces on level caps like 60,70,80 and 85. Leveling isn't hard.

Learning how to tame Exotic beasts isn't a spell. It's a talent that provides more talent points to our pets and regarding when it should be provided is up to the developers. I'm merely suggesting that maybe it could be different. In regards to balance I've explained how Blizzard could balance it and it will be mentioned again below.

Just a example, you ding lv 15 run to tame that pritty white core hound what spell would you be getting from the pet?

Ancient Hysteria [Exotic Ability]
Instant 6 min cooldown
Increases melee, ranged, and spell casting speed by 30% for all party and raid members. Lasts 40 sec. Allies receiving this effect will become Sated and be unable to benefit from Bloodlust or Time Warp again for 10 min.

Which shamans don't learn till 70-ish (still gotta look that up /slap me) and Mages don't get till 80+ (to lazy to look up yey slacking)

In Cata leveling will be easy, if not easier then it is now. Blizzard is updating their new site to offer gaming guides to new players also when you buy WoW the game clerk should offer gaming guides or they should be located near the clerk so you notice em. Not forgetting Google, YouTube and ofc countless of forums to help out new players and people ingame (even though som ar rudes or take manners as gold seller spam :s)

[Kalliope]

Just a example, you ding lv 15 run to tame that pritty white core hound what spell would you be getting from the pet?

Ancient Hysteria [Exotic Ability]
Instant 6 min cooldown
Increases melee, ranged, and spell casting speed by 30% for all party and raid members. Lasts 40 sec. Allies receiving this effect will become Sated and be unable to benefit from Bloodlust or Time Warp again for 10 min.

Which shamans don't learn till 70-ish (still gotta look that up /slap me) and Mages don't get till 80+ (to lazy to look up yey slacking)

For reference, it's currently 69 for hunters (corehounds/exotics), 70 for shamans, and 85 for mages.

[Lisaara]

That's probably why they have us waiting so long to tame exotics, so we level with the other classes.

[lilatha]

Yey Kalliope <3 Been waiting for someone to tell me /loves

But this post is about getting exotics are lower levels so I used my example. (plus I got hounds on teh brain B:)

[Kalliope]

Yey Kalliope <3 Been waiting for someone to tell me /loves

But this post is about getting exotics are lower levels so I used my example. (plus I got hounds on teh brain B:)

Yeah, that's a really good example of why exotics won't be lowered, and probably why it wasn't done in the first place. BM hunters would become Ridiculously Overpowered, since they'd be the only ones who could get bloodlust at that level, whatever level "that level" might be. Considering that the iconic shaman ability has been given to not one, but two, other classes, giving it to another class at a significantly lower level would be likely to cause Huge Amounts of Drama. >_<

[Feath3r]

I don't see why we can't tame Exotics at lower level and our final 31 Point talent is something that basically says that we've mastered our bond with our pets and have unlocked their full potential and that unlocks the Exotics' abilities and gives all our pets their extra talent points. That way we get our exotics, but we don't get the "overpowered" abilities too early.

[Lisaara]

Yey Kalliope <3 Been waiting for someone to tell me /loves

But this post is about getting exotics are lower levels so I used my example. (plus I got hounds on teh brain B:)

Yeah, that's a really good example of why exotics won't be lowered, and probably why it wasn't done in the first place. BM hunters would become Ridiculously Overpowered, since they'd be the only ones who could get bloodlust at that level, whatever level "that level" might be. Considering that the iconic shaman ability has been given to not one, but two, other classes, giving it to another class at a significantly lower level would be likely to cause Huge Amounts of Drama. >_<

*shudder* Oh the drama.....the shitstorm it would cause....would be bigger than Deathwing's bit black molten behind.

[Kalliope]

I don't see why we can't tame Exotics at lower level and our final 31 Point talent is something that basically says that we've mastered our bond with our pets and have unlocked their full potential and that unlocks the Exotics' abilities and gives all our pets their extra talent points. That way we get our exotics, but we don't get the "overpowered" abilities too early.

This is an interesting idea. I kinda like it.

[rackornar]

Correct me if I am wrong but exotics only came in at the start of WoTLK?
SO if we managed all those low levels without them why do we need them now? I could go 1-80 without using one perfectly fine.

It would be nice to have a signature somewhere on par with Chimera Shot/Explosive Shot that is offered to the other trees.

We do have a signature on par. It's called Beastial Wrath.

Our current signature skill is Intimidation, that is what we get when we spec into BM. Its pretty lame compared to that which other classes get even what other hunters get. I was mistaken when typing it and for some reason thought marks got chimera but they get aimed shot. As far as other classes they all get something that is pretty deep in their old trees and its usually a big part of that spec. Feral Druids receive Mangle, Fury Warriors get Bloodthirst, Enhancement Shamans get Dual Wield and Lava Lash, Resto Shamans pick up Earth Shield, Assassination Rogues get Mutilate it only goes on. Most of these things are dps skills. BM current is a stun and that's it. Bestial Wrath doesn't really make sense as no one has received a cooldown type skill but getting Exotics and the extra pet talent points fits quite nicely.

I also hardly see Corehound Bloodlust being enough to stop them from doing it. It is a 10 minute cooldown it won't in any way make leveling super easy to have that once per 10 minutes and if it is then it would be very easy to just make it so Corehounds don't gain that ability until you level to 69 or 70.

[Wark]

I think this is why I dislike the current Exotic system: it ties substantial benefits to select Exotic families. The hunter has to make a call between sticking to whatever they had before the option of Exotics, which are almost always suboptimal, or picking up new pets that they may or may not like for the competitive edge.

Consider the spider and the silithid. Both are Cunning pets, ensuring the same stats and potential talents. Both have the same special ability: they shoot webs. But the silithid gets a second ability for additional utility, just because it's Exotic. From a mechanical perspective, the silithid is completely superior: as soon as it's available, it has everything a spider has and then some. If all pets are faceless and interchangeable, a deep-BM hunter will ditch a spider as soon as it can get a silithid and never look back.

However, I'd say the existence of this forum rather definitely proves that lots of hunters DON'T consider their pets interchangeable blocks of 1s and 0s. I get attached to my pets. You get attached to your pets. Even many people I know who only casually dabble in hunterdom get fantastically attached to their pets-- I remember one of my old tanking buddies, a die-hard Warrior, eventually got a belf hunter alt. He asked me for advice for a pet: from a mechanical standpoint, what would be his best option? I perused Petopia, weighed the options, and suggested that he might like a bat for its AoE capabilities. So he ran out, got the first bat that appealed to him, and dubbed it Squeeky. Up until that point I don't think he particularly cared whether it was a bat, a flying vole, or a cactus-- if it got the job done, he was satisfied. But by naming it... well, even years later when bats were no longer the AoEing hotness of the Second Days, he never got rid of Squeeky. Some of it was quirky little gameplay features, like how the great big flapping wings were good for driving the meleers in the group up a wall-- and the noise! As someone who played a Hunter primarily to drive the rest of the team absolutely insane, he was in heaven. But some of it, I suspect, was that Squeeky was Squeeky: the bat that he got as a widdle itty bitty Hunter, who had been with him for quite awhile. His partner in crime.

Had some sort of Bat++ family made itself available-- Dire Flying Vole, if you will-- I don't think he would have considered upgrading with much gusto, and what the heck is the point of an awesome shiny new pet "upgrade" if it builds in reasons for the Hunters to dislike it?

There are plenty of other possible systems that would combine "a Beast Master's pet is flat out better" with "they can use whatever they darn well want." Slickrock's idea that the "exotic"ness apply to anything the Beast Master owns and all pets get an Exotic ability when they hit a number of talent points spent is just one way to do it. (You'd probably want to change the term to something besides "Exotic" at that point, but it's a small matter.) I just wish they'd tie ALL the benefits to "it's a pet the Beast Master uses" rather than specific families, so that if you want a silithid, you could get a silithid... but a spider would be just as smart a choice.

[Slickrock]

I don't see why we can't tame Exotics at lower level and our final 31 Point talent is something that basically says that we've mastered our bond with our pets and have unlocked their full potential and that unlocks the Exotics' abilities and gives all our pets their extra talent points. That way we get our exotics, but we don't get the "overpowered" abilities too early.

This is an interesting idea. I kinda like it.

This is kinda what I had tried to explain a few pages back, but no one understood me.

They could also effect this change with scaling as well, since they are doing that for everything else now (and that would actually help us at later levels since some of our pet spells don't scale currently).

It would also help everyone get all the skins, while not taking exotics away from BM. (And I like the idea that your PVP opponent would not know you are BM until that pet is in his face big and red and isn't dying so fast).

I also hardly see Corehound Bloodlust being enough to stop them from doing it. It is a 10 minute cooldown it won't in any way make leveling super easy to have that once per 10 minutes and if it is then it would be very easy to just make it so Corehounds don't gain that ability until you level to 69 or 70.

Scaling. Let there be ranks of that spell.

[cowmuflage]

Well you'd have to fix MM and stuff aswell as our specs skills suck intill around 60ish

[Kalliope]

I also hardly see Corehound Bloodlust being enough to stop them from doing it. It is a 10 minute cooldown it won't in any way make leveling super easy to have that once per 10 minutes and if it is then it would be very easy to just make it so Corehounds don't gain that ability until you level to 69 or 70.

Scaling. Let there be ranks of that spell.

Noooo, we just had spell ranks eliminated. It's all or nothing.

[Cerah]

I have to put in my two copper here. I think getting exotics at level 10 would actually be a good idea, simply because it puts us on equal footing to that other pet-specific class/spec we're all forgetting -- Demonology Warlocks.

DE 'locks now get the Felguard as their lvl 10 spec ability. While I must say that this may be quite different from the old 'lock/demon leveling experience (getting a new demon every 10 levels or so, and getting your Felguard at level 50), it does make sense, a lot more than, say, giving them Metamorphosis right off the bat. DE warlocks still *get* their other demons, and while imps, voidwalkers, succubus and felstalkers may have limited uses in dungeons after getting their felguards so early on, that's not to say that the other demons aren't still useful in other ways. (my Demonologist alt, Emielee, still regularly uses her voidwalker, Throkmon, for soloing, even at lvl 80).

Frost mages, too, get their water elemental, as a pernament summons, at level 10, when before it was quite a ways down the Frost talent tree, and was a temporary guardian unless you had the glyph.

Giving Beastmaster Hunters access to exotic pets at the same level would be just fair. Besides, there's only a few places where you can even *get* low-level exotics -- the Kurken, the worms in RFC come to mind, with both being a little difficult to get to without help for their respective opposite factions. Mid levels (around 30-50), there's a few chimeras and sililids available, at about 55, devilsaurs. Also, unlike a 'lock or mage, BM hunters who really wanted lower level exotics would actually have to put in the effort to go out and get them.

It would not make BMs overpowered compared to SV or MM, or compared to other DPS classess, IMO. With pet damage nomalization, the buffs that an exotic pet would bring to a dungeon group are just a little something extra, nothing gamebreaking. Some non-exotics, like cats and wolves, already have the exact same buffs as spirit beasts (which you wouldn't be able to get until lvl 76 anyway), and devilsaurs (lvl 55ish).

So yeah, I think giving BMs access to exotics would not only be a good idea, it would be fair in comparison to other pet-using classes. Besides, I want my future Undead BM to get her worm early.

I went and posted this response in the official forums as well.

[Raydex-of-the-dawn]

Why? It will just make more people think BM is all about exotics. Its not.

So...it's all about Intimidation? xD LOL GUIES I'M SO SCARY SO I MUST BE BM! 8DDDD

The DE locks get Felguards! (I was so surprised when I was hanging in Westfall and a leetle level 11 gnome with WOAHUGE FELGUARD ran past. I whispered them and was like "woah FG@lvl10 now? D:" and they were like "yeah! "

It's not like exotics are that OP. Oh, look. That hunter can get haste buffs once every 10 minutes AND slow spellcasting. That hunter can do a ludicriously-low-damage AoE AND reduce armor. Totally OP rite? Not at all like "that hunter can do craploads of damage by pressing one button and that hunter can shoot for WOAHUGE damage and not ever have to serpent sting. Not nearly as strong as a haste buff or slow spellcasting D:"

[Worba]

I'm pretty content on what we have now. Lower levels are to learn the class and how it works. You should work for your exotics. You want em? You'll work for it just like if you want an exotic beast IRL, you need to work to get the 'right/license' to own it. Same basic concept.

Yeah - just like how SV hunters have to work for their explosive shot!

Oh.

You mean this principle doesn't stand up to serious testing?

Dang.

[Lisaara]

Well guys. Let me put it this way.

If they should ever give us exotics at level 10.....

10 bucks says they will take away their second ability. PERMANENTLY. Blizzard is known for this sort of thing to pull.

So is that really worth it to you then? Ask yourself that cause that's exactly what would happen because it would cause an uproar.

[Worba]

For more information check this out =)

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... 47344409#4

I'm trying to get them to allow us to have exotic pets at lower levels in the expansion.

/signed

I've posted several times about this, here

http://forums.wow-petopia.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=4253

and at the wow forums

[Lisaara]

For more information check this out =)

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/threa ... 47344409#4

I'm trying to get them to allow us to have exotic pets at lower levels in the expansion.

/signed

I've posted several times about this, here

http://forums.wow-petopia.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=4253

and at the wow forums

I noticed you commented it was just a minor gripe, meaning you yourself can deal with it. you acknowledge it sucks but it's not the end of the world.

This topic, so far, seems to make it look like it's a big deal and it is the end of the world if we cant get exotics as lowbies. Just a pattern I'm noticing. Not trying to be mean or rude.

[Worba]

Well guys. Let me put it this way.

If they should ever give us exotics at level 10.....

10 bucks says they will take away their second ability. PERMANENTLY. Blizzard is known for this sort of thing to pull.

So is that really worth it to you then? Ask yourself that cause that's exactly what would happen because it would cause an uproar.

Or, in a nerfy huff they could restrict bows/guns proficiency to 40, thus requiring new hunters to first learn the ropes as melee hunters - are we all prepared for THAT??

20 bucks say they won't, and that any pet abilities pre-69 would be handled by simple scaling logic.