Crappy Groups

[Bytail]

Ah, I've got a good one to add to the epicness of idiots.

Just a typical night, hit up a random group for my two frost emblems before I hit the hay. HoL came up, the group was quiet but seemed decent, druid tank and a priest, no problem. A BM myself, I knew my part, stay back, wait for tank to aggro, all that good stuff. On pugs I like to take my spirit beast along, no grief for that, no wipes, no bad pulls until I noticed that the tank started to tank in cat form instead of bear half way through. The healer still didn't seem to have a problem and no one complained so we went along our merry way until we started to reach the end.

Without warning, the tank decided to zero in on me and the griefing started and wouldn't stop. 'omg, a bm, why aren't you a mm?' 'haha, he has this as his gear and this in his gem slots' 'what a noob' Don't know what their problem was, I have good gear. Getting annoyed and trying to ignore them with the tank still in kitty form, we started the fight. We're pretty much mopping the floor with the big guy while the tank and his rogue friend decide its not enough to mock me and start linking up my gear in p to laugh at it while the fight is still going on and even after, with the boss laying dead on the ground.

Then the priest pulls up the damage meter and starts swearing, asking how hell did I do 4k? I topped the charts by leaps and bounds, surpassed all 4 of them... and there was silence, it was priceless.

[Makoes]

lol thats awsome!!

[kamoodle5]

Woo-hoo! Now that's music to my ears. It's just so hilarious to watch a group get embarrassed over a BM hunter that has proved they can be quite as good as anyone else.

[Kalliope]

Maybe because you were actually dpsing instead of trash talking in party chat. Seriously, there's no better way of putting your foot in your mouth than calling someone else out on their gear, THEN GETTING BEATEN BY THEM. What a bunch of scrubs. Yay for the priest linking meters.

[Raloth]

I love this sort of thing...because I know the situation all too well! Funny they never say a word after it's seen that a BM HUNTER outdps's them all >:D

[Mockingbird]

Today's not-actually-all-that-bad-bad group:

Good tank
Good healer
Me as top DPS
warlock as 2nd DPS (~1/2 of mine, but he was in blues)
rogue as worst DPS.

And when I say worst, I mean Heroic UK, 550 DPS. Five hundred and fifty.

I checked his gear. 2T9, 1T10, one heirloom weapon and one epic, plus sundry other level 80 epics. I genuinely can't understand how he did so little. FoK spam would do more than that, ignroing bosses completely.

When the tank asked if he was ok just before the last boss, he quit the group without a word. Weird.

[Pokerfase]

Last weekend, I was booted from Nexus... for typing.

[Tratzul]

I haven't been in too many groups as of late, or even bad ones, but one thing that some groups have been harping on me as of late (and in past) is this:

"Turn off Growl!", when it's already off. <.<'

>.< If I hear that again, I'll just say; "You have Passive on, don't you?" Since many tanks I've ran with at early levels seem to have aggro troubles, yet choose to blame me (most likely the only hunter in group) for their problem.

[Vephriel]

I haven't been in too many groups as of late, or even bad ones, but one thing that some groups have been harping on me as of late (and in past) is this:

"Turn off Growl!", when it's already off. <.<'

Ughhhh I HATE that one. Tanks love to say that right off the bat, as if assuming every hunter is too stupid to have their pet's Growl turned off. I encounter it quite frequently, it just gets aggravating after so many false accusations.

[Quin]

Ah, I've got a good one to add to the epicness of idiots.

Just a typical night, hit up a random group for my two frost emblems before I hit the hay. HoL came up, the group was quiet but seemed decent, druid tank and a priest, no problem. A BM myself, I knew my part, stay back, wait for tank to aggro, all that good stuff. On pugs I like to take my spirit beast along, no grief for that, no wipes, no bad pulls until I noticed that the tank started to tank in cat form instead of bear half way through. The healer still didn't seem to have a problem and no one complained so we went along our merry way until we started to reach the end.

Without warning, the tank decided to zero in on me and the griefing started and wouldn't stop. 'omg, a bm, why aren't you a mm?' 'haha, he has this as his gear and this in his gem slots' 'what a noob' Don't know what their problem was, I have good gear. Getting annoyed and trying to ignore them with the tank still in kitty form, we started the fight. We're pretty much mopping the floor with the big guy while the tank and his rogue friend decide its not enough to mock me and start linking up my gear in p to laugh at it while the fight is still going on and even after, with the boss laying dead on the ground.

Then the priest pulls up the damage meter and starts swearing, asking how hell did I do 4k? I topped the charts by leaps and bounds, surpassed all 4 of them... and there was silence, it was priceless.

I've had that happen. People whining about the fact I prefer to play Beast Master...right up until we link Damage Meter and I'm top of the charts with a 'lazy' 4.5k plus.

[Worba]

I haven't been in too many groups as of late, or even bad ones, but one thing that some groups have been harping on me as of late (and in past) is this:

"Turn off Growl!", when it's already off. <.<'

Ughhhh I HATE that one. Tanks love to say that right off the bat, as if assuming every hunter is too stupid to have their pet's Growl turned off. I encounter it quite frequently, it just gets aggravating after so many false accusations.

That or "turn off pet aggro", which I (being generous) take to mean "put it on defensive", though I'm sure at least some of these mental giants actually do think hunters can disable pet-generated threat... I think most of them are just freaking out because I like to open with MD + big threat burst, then ease back.

I usually only do this after watching other DPS pull threat from the tank fight after fight, and then lo and behold the trend stops at the exact same time that I start using this tactic.

Usually when they see (as if by magic!) all the mobs piling onto the tank, and staying there, they tend to shut up and start focusing on doing their own jobs.

But there will always be people who find it easier to shout "HUNTARD!1one!1" than to understand how other classes work.

[Ardawen]

Just wanted to give an example of how a group can go if two people agree that one of the group does need help. Me as mage and a paladin who was at that moment tanking, started helping out our rogue, as he was doing realy low damage. So we started asking questions and stuff. The necromancer in the group didn't like what we where doing and started to be rude. The healer didn't mind so we slowed down the dungeon a bit and finished it. After that the 3 of us did another dungeon to help him out some more and his damage was already starting to go up. And i had a new friend after this all. .

[Worba]

I've had that happen. People whining about the fact I prefer to play Beast Master...right up until we link Damage Meter and I'm top of the charts with a 'lazy' 4.5k plus.

It's funny how people are so quick to diss on the BM spec... the other day I was playing my blood elf and some other hunter asked for help taking down Chillmaw.

So I helped her and afterwards she looks at my SB and gives me crap for having BM spec... then I pointed out to her that BM spec is what I use for solo'ing Chillmaw...

Silence.

(I didn't even bother pointing out to her that BM was my off-spec, either)

[Kalliope]

It's funny how people are so quick to diss on the BM spec... the other day I was playing my blood elf and some other hunter asked for help taking down Chillmaw.

So I helped her and afterwards she looks at my SB and gives me crap for having BM spec... then I pointed out to her that BM spec is what I use for solo'ing Chillmaw...

Silence.

(I didn't even bother pointing out to her that BM was my off-spec, either)

Hilarious! Seriously, people who ask for help have no right to criticize the people they're getting help from. Especially when they're in the wrong like that. *flaunts marks-spec soloing of Chillmaw at said rude hunter*

I haven't been in too many groups as of late, or even bad ones, but one thing that some groups have been harping on me as of late (and in past) is this:

"Turn off Growl!", when it's already off. <.<'

>.< If I hear that again, I'll just say; "You have Passive on, don't you?" Since many tanks I've ran with at early levels seem to have aggro troubles, yet choose to blame me (most likely the only hunter in group) for their problem.

Sigh, yes. It's a question of threat generation on a particular target, which a lowbie tank may not be good at. Especially if you're BM, if you're hitting an off-target or a poorly threated (I can make up words!) main target, your pet is GOING to get aggro. Period. Now sometimes, the tank hasn't gotten the abilities they need yet for good AoE threat, but most of the time, it's a question of the dps outgearing them or them not really knowing how to tank. At least in my experience, from both sides of the fence. One of the reasons misdirect and tricks of the trade are getting changed is because those abilities can make tanks "better." In other words, doing their job for them. >_< Sigh.

This reminds me of the other night. Queued into regular Nexus on my warrior tank; me 'n my buddies are level 70. I toss vigilance on my bf, since his lock consistently pulls major threat/dps and I always regret not putting it on him. We get to the room with the mini-boss (the commander who's an extra boss on heroic) and are a pack or two in when the level 72 owl asks for vig. I glance at the damage meters, since he DOES outlevel my bf. The owl is closer to the rogue using rank 1 mutilate and who has no AoE yet than to my bf. So I tell him matter-of-factly that he can have vigilance when he becomes more threatening than the lock. Apparently, he didn't take this too well. He started starfiring off-targets (who I taunted back immediately) and pulled the group after the commander's pack with starfall (which I grabbed easily with an AoE taunt and a well-placed shockwave). He then stopped dpsing at all and d/ced a minute or so later, which was when we kicked him and picked up a hunter who was also downranking abilities (my guess was that the hunter hadn't hit a trainer and the rogue had recently respecced - I told the latter at the end of the run that he was downranking, since it was just the one ability). So the run went fine once the emo owl was gone. Give me the downrankers over the noob demanding a threat reduction that he doesn't need any day. It amused the hell out of me that he couldn't pull aggro without cheating and actually e-raged over this. So friggin' bad. >_<

[kamoodle5]

Well, there is one thing I learned just recently when it comes to other people in dungeon runs: dual or multi-boxing more than one toon in a dungeon group is a very bad idea. Unless you're a psychic, you can't do two or more things at once. Your mind can only concentrate on one thing.

On my draenei hunter last night, I did my first run of the purple section in Maraudon. My group was a druid, a priest, a warrior, and two hunters, including me. One thing I noticed was how both the warrior and the priest were from the same realm, the same guild, and they both looked the same aside from the gear. I immediately realized on the first few group of trash mobs that the tank was losing health too fast and he didn't seem to be undergeared or anything. In fact, his health was slightly higher than me, which is the way it should be. Then, it seemed the healer healed every other half of the time while the tank tanked. I did fear a few times of wipes because his health did get very low at times; I was urged to have my pet's Growl on on some times to get some mobs off of him. I got no complaints, plus my pet was losing health much less than he was (I didn't have a tenacity with me; Calamity the wolf was with me).

We downed the demon boss without too much trouble. Then, the tank and the healer decided to go a little bit further into the dungeon afterward. If he was planning to go all the way to the princess, I would've most likely ditched group because of his poor performance. When we got to those spherical blobs, I warned everyone to not tank them, as the blobs hit like a freight train but rather kite them. However, the tank did...not...listen, and neither did the other hunter with her pet. When we got a bit further down through the dirty pools of Maraudon surrounded by murky elementals and blobs, that was when the near-wipe happened with only me surviving. The tank and the other hunter's pet engaged the blobs of course, then some of the other different blobs came. They eventually got overwhelmed in a hurry, followed by the healer. After I managed to kill one of the spherical blobs by kiting, and yes, my pet was on passive at this time, I dismissed my pet, FDed, and watched the other two trying to run for it. I literally facepalmed at the other hunter for not FDing either. After they wiped with me as the only one that survived, both the tank and the healer ditched group after they returned to the dungeon. Me and the other three then suspected those two toons were played by one player by the actions they've been doing. After their frustration with trying to find the way to the dungeon and ending up going to the angel to rez before returning to the dungeon, the group got disbanded.

On a bright note, after a few times running through that section of Maraudon last night, I was able to get my blue pants from the demon boss and a new buddy to chat with. Someone who has returned to WoW after four years. He's surprised of how much WoW has changed.

And on another side note which is just as bright, the night before last, when I was in a group with some folks and we were doing the orange part of Maraudon, we decided to go ahead and finish the rest of the dungeon, despite us being a bit low-leveled for the princess and those mobs. The run went through flawlessly. We never died once and nobody slacked off nor ditched group at any time. At least that tank there heeded my warning about the blobs and we all kited them down with no problem.

[Tratzul]

Ok, to start this off; I got into Halls of Lightning, first time in there, and I announced it to the group, as normal for me.

The tank was a pally, who (has 6k GS, but I don't care). He kept pulling about 15 - 20 mobs in each pull onto him, then died after the 3rd (about 9 mobs, slowing down, I guess) pull from Ionar. @.@ He kept telling the others to stay back, or even AFK follow the healer, a shammy. All 3 (a DPS shammy as well) were on vent, so not much chatter in Party.

I died to one mob that charged me (a giant Vyrkul, after Ionar was downed), and the tank said to FD before it, after I had died, which alone was odd. After the charge I had 1hp left, then promptly died. Checked the log: It was for a 10k hit, no crit, to my 14k hp. Either I died from the very short fall, or a mob struck me with invisible lightning, or it was a freak-death.

...How was I supposed to know I'm going to be charged at? >.<

Then the healer seemed to DC constantly, before all 3 others (the healer, the other DPS, Enhance, I would guess). Before me, and the final add DPS, a rogue were left.

Apparently, a party for an instance now is just 3 people, and it was a carry, which I was never told about. -.-'

[Mockingbird]

One of my RL friends has a 72 tank warrior he is levelling through DF. He encouraged me to dust off my priest (68 currently) so we could instance otgether if I got a couple of levels...

Dungeon finder last night, priest as healer (Disc spec), I ran three instances, all Sethekk Halls.

Now, I don't know if I'm just no good at mana management, but I was drinking EVERY PULL pretty much. On bosses I was ok with shadowfiend, but otherwise it just seemed really hard Over 3 runs we had I think 2 total wipes (different groups each time) and a fair number of deaths. Most of the time, deaths were from pulling 3+ packs due to feared people, but I still felt bad. In my defence, the first to die was usually me, and I always kept the tank and at least one healing-capable DPS up with my final casts.

The problem I ran into most, was a tank that would pull 2 groups and not tank them. I'd give him 2-3 seconds for threat, then refresh his shield and add a HoT and BAM, I'd have aggro from half the mobs, and he wouldn't come and get them. At one point I was ressing a mage (the same mage who killed me every time I got mind controlled by the totems). I'm on ~5% mana, ressing someone in the next room, and the tank pulls 2 groups and bitches at me when he dies. Grrrr.

I asked in guild chat whether this ever gets better. Apparently, it doesn't. I am reliably informed that PuGs as a healer have always sucked, and will always suck, unless you take your own tank with you that is trustworthy.

[Kalliope]

If you were dying first, then the tank sucked, cause you shouldn't be pulling healing aggro. He was also probably why you were short on mana, though that probably had something to do with being a priest (and probably in crappy leveling gear).

Bad groups suck and there are many of them. They also usually tend to blame the healer, since they don't even realize how bad they are....which is part of why they're bad. And that is what this thread is for!

The good news? You're 68. You can go to Northrend and get leveling greens, which will help a lot. There's a sexy sexy crit trinket from the Coldarra quest area when you get there.

More good news! Your tank buddy could carry you through UK once you have a few of those greens. At 69, he can start carrying you through Nexus too. Level differences are overrated. You'll catch up to him sooner or later; he might as well help you now. My warrior has been doing that for some friends and it's worked out well. They've caught up to me, too. The only issue will be when a new instance opens up for him and not for you, cause you won't be able to get in. But it's easier when it's the healer who's lower level. They can be carried so long as the tank is geared.

But yeah, if your friend's 72, he's basically mostly still looking at the instances you can get into (or will soon get into). So grab some Northrend gear and go for it.

[Sukurachi]

I have never done a "real" dungeon before (other than solo easy low-level dungeons on high-lvel toons).

Yesterday, two friends pushed me into finally joining them in randoms (yay! got a beautiful new bow for my hunter on very first dungeon).

Well, they said "let's do it again!"... but... heroic this time.

I nearly wet myself. But I went and it was... almost great.

4 different tanks.
4 different suicidal tanks.
4 different hyper-active suicidal tanks.
in a row.
within 10 minutes.
4 wipes.

I swear, one tank joined the group and we had barely said "hi" we were all dead. Like 10 seconds.
I am SO glad that I was with friends... that way at least, no one could blame it on the "noob huntard".
I mean, I'm new to dungeons and all, but at least I KNOW not to run into the middle of 20 gigantic elite mobs while the rest of my group, including my healer, are still sitting, unbuffed, drinking and eating.

[Sarayana]

I asked in guild chat whether this ever gets better. Apparently, it doesn't. I am reliably informed that PuGs as a healer have always sucked, and will always suck, unless you take your own tank with you that is trustworthy.

I have three level 80 healers, two that leveled through the LFD... and I can honestly say that your guildies are mistaken. Once you get to ~75, you'll start to see a lot more solid tanks. Also, if you heal dungeons throughout those levels (I'm not saying exclusively, but one or two each day you're leveling the toon while you quest) you'll learn quickly whether it's the tank or not. That's one of the hardest things to learn as a new healer - to gauge the quality of the tank.

Once you get really good, though, it'll take a very bad tank to wipe you, and you'll see that guy who's still wearing blues and doesn't know how to LoS pull as a challenge.