Suggested Change To Exotic Pets

[pengupuff]

I also must disagree, for the simple fact that, with the possible exception of certain arena compositions and maybe some casual battleground fun, Beast Mastery trails behind the other two hunter specs in terms of utility and sheer DPS. Now I know I'll get a ton of replies all like "OMG BUT I DO 20k DPS IN BEAST MASTERY." That's fine, but the fact remains that through even, controlled testing, Marksmanship and Survival leave BM in the dust in terms of damage.

I will admit there are a handful of fights in which the hunter may be in melee range a lot where being in BM may actually be a DPS gain, but those situations are few and far between.

So, considering that BM is really only ideal for leveling and soloing, what saves it when you hit the level cap are the exclusive pets. It's a nice perk to an otherwise unrewarding spec.

[Alastiel]

I don't know... I always, always play BM, but I think that this is a wonderful idea. I love the BM spec because of the pet-focused playstyle. My pet is not just a glorified DoT; I have to work to keep it alive and use it's abilities at the opportune time in order to make sure that I am of use. The fact that BM allows me to tame special beasts is a huge bonus, but I wouldn't mind seeing MM hunters or SV hunters with the same type of pets at all. I'm sure that practically every hunter has BM at least as an offspec in order to get those fancy looking pets, so I doubt that the competition would go up. If this were implemented, I could still use my favourite pets on those few occasions when I play around with other specs. However, I doubt it would ever make it into the game. Making extra skills for all the pets would likely be way too much work.

[Bushsbuddy]

I also must disagree, for the simple fact that, with the possible exception of certain arena compositions and maybe some casual battleground fun, Beast Mastery trails behind the other two hunter specs in terms of utility and sheer DPS. Now I know I'll get a ton of replies all like "OMG BUT I DO 20k DPS IN BEAST MASTERY." That's fine, but the fact remains that through even, controlled testing, Marksmanship and Survival leave BM in the dust in terms of damage.

I will admit there are a handful of fights in which the hunter may be in melee range a lot where being in BM may actually be a DPS gain, but those situations are few and far between.

So, considering that BM is really only ideal for leveling and soloing, what saves it when you hit the level cap are the exclusive pets. It's a nice perk to an otherwise unrewarding spec.

I agree with you, but I don't think thats acceptable. Being balanced around having pretty pets is a poor foundation for a spec. Blizz puts very little effort into making BM interesting BECAUSE they know people play it for the pets. If the pet looks weren't exclusive, and people starting leaving the spec, blizz might actually to make it a fun and competative spec.

[Lisaara]

I also must disagree, for the simple fact that, with the possible exception of certain arena compositions and maybe some casual battleground fun, Beast Mastery trails behind the other two hunter specs in terms of utility and sheer DPS. Now I know I'll get a ton of replies all like "OMG BUT I DO 20k DPS IN BEAST MASTERY." That's fine, but the fact remains that through even, controlled testing, Marksmanship and Survival leave BM in the dust in terms of damage.

I will admit there are a handful of fights in which the hunter may be in melee range a lot where being in BM may actually be a DPS gain, but those situations are few and far between.

So, considering that BM is really only ideal for leveling and soloing, what saves it when you hit the level cap are the exclusive pets. It's a nice perk to an otherwise unrewarding spec.

I agree with you, but I don't think thats acceptable. Being balanced around having pretty pets is a poor foundation for a spec. Blizz puts very little effort into making BM interesting BECAUSE they know people play it for the pets. If the pet looks weren't exclusive, and people starting leaving the spec, blizz might actually to make it a fun and competative spec.

Um...I must point out how wrong that statement is. I, for one, dont just play BM for the pets. Beast Master is my MAIN spec. I use it for raiding, pvp, everything. And yes, there have been times I've out DPSed Marksman and Survival because I know my specs and my pets. I use it because I enjoy the simplicity of the spec and of course, the bonding with my pets, exotic or not. I bond with them all.

So please don't lump BM as just wanting pretty pets. I'm passionate about BM and I find that comment a tad bit insulting to the class. It's almost as bad as people going "LOL! BM is only 4 lvling!"

Sorry but that really hit a nerve....

[pengupuff]

I also must disagree, for the simple fact that, with the possible exception of certain arena compositions and maybe some casual battleground fun, Beast Mastery trails behind the other two hunter specs in terms of utility and sheer DPS. Now I know I'll get a ton of replies all like "OMG BUT I DO 20k DPS IN BEAST MASTERY." That's fine, but the fact remains that through even, controlled testing, Marksmanship and Survival leave BM in the dust in terms of damage.

I will admit there are a handful of fights in which the hunter may be in melee range a lot where being in BM may actually be a DPS gain, but those situations are few and far between.

So, considering that BM is really only ideal for leveling and soloing, what saves it when you hit the level cap are the exclusive pets. It's a nice perk to an otherwise unrewarding spec.

I agree with you, but I don't think thats acceptable. Being balanced around having pretty pets is a poor foundation for a spec. Blizz puts very little effort into making BM interesting BECAUSE they know people play it for the pets. If the pet looks weren't exclusive, and people starting leaving the spec, blizz might actually to make it a fun and competative spec.

Um...I must point out how wrong that statement is. I, for one, dont just play BM for the pets. Beast Master is my MAIN spec. I use it for raiding, pvp, everything. And yes, there have been times I've out DPSed Marksman and Survival because I know my specs and my pets. I use it because I enjoy the simplicity of the spec and of course, the bonding with my pets, exotic or not. I bond with them all.

So please don't lump BM as just wanting pretty pets. I'm passionate about BM and I find that comment a tad bit insulting to the class. It's almost as bad as people going "LOL! BM is only 4 lvling!"

Sorry but that really hit a nerve....

I've noticed that a lot of peeps on this forum get angry at the drop of a pin, for some reason. It's like everyone's hiding out in the bushes, just looking for something they can take offense to, then BAM! They pounce like a hungry manbearpig.

Lets all just sit back, relax, and have a glass of tequila while we gather around a campfire singing John Mayer songs out of key.

[Adam-Savage]

Also Rhy: Since its SURVIVAL and MARKSMAN, they dont wanna be seen. They're wanting to survive, like a rogue. Pets arent their thing either. BM is all about the pets. SV and MM is all about THEM, not the pet.

This. If you want an exotic pet then go BM. The entire point of BM is it about the pet and the ability to tame exotic pets. Thus the name Beast Master. Your the master of all beasts. The point of different specs is because there different. That would be like a boomie asking for resto only healing spells..

[Bushsbuddy]

Also Rhy: Since its SURVIVAL and MARKSMAN, they dont wanna be seen. They're wanting to survive, like a rogue. Pets arent their thing either. BM is all about the pets. SV and MM is all about THEM, not the pet.

This. If you want an exotic pet then go BM. The entire point of BM is it about the pet and the ability to tame exotic pets. Thus the name Beast Master. Your the master of all beasts. The point of different specs is because there different. That would be like a boomie asking for resto only healing spells..

What was the point of Beast Mastery before they could tame exotics in Wrath? People still played BM in vanilla and BC.

[Kalliope]

Also Rhy: Since its SURVIVAL and MARKSMAN, they dont wanna be seen. They're wanting to survive, like a rogue. Pets arent their thing either. BM is all about the pets. SV and MM is all about THEM, not the pet.

This. If you want an exotic pet then go BM. The entire point of BM is it about the pet and the ability to tame exotic pets. Thus the name Beast Master. Your the master of all beasts. The point of different specs is because there different. That would be like a boomie asking for resto only healing spells..

What was the point of Beast Mastery before they could tame exotics in Wrath? People still played BM in vanilla and BC.

That was before BW and TBW got nerfed.

[Lisaara]

Kalli said it best.

Pengu: I've gotten better at not being offended but people are allowed to get offended when something offensive was said. I wasn't screaming at him. I was pointing out to him that his statement was very offensive to some, including me.

[Wark]

So please don't lump BM as just wanting pretty pets. I'm passionate about BM and I find that comment a tad bit insulting to the class. It's almost as bad as people going "LOL! BM is only 4 lvling!"

This. If you want an exotic pet then go BM. The entire point of BM is it about the pet and the ability to tame exotic pets. Thus the name Beast Master. Your the master of all beasts. The point of different specs is because there different. That would be like a boomie asking for resto only healing spells..

Full disclosure: I only kept a BM spec on the side during Wrath because of dualspec; I spent most of the time I was obligated to "bring the big numbers" sporting a Survival spec, because it had a better number and order of buttons for me to push, and the pet I WANTED to bring was a non-exotic-- by attempting to raid with a BM spec, I would have 1. brought slightly worse numbers but 2. been pressured to change my pet to give my numbers an edge, because they would have needed them. Plus, 3, playstyle I didn't like as much.

And I think that's why, for me, every time I see someone say "exotics are THE reason to be BM" I grit my teeth. I was BM all the way through vanilla, even thought it meant I instead raided on my alts. I was BM all the way through Burning Crusade, and in fact the catalyst for my brand new raiding guild converted most of it's hunter core to Beast Mastery. I was BM at the start of Wrath, until they nuked our numbers so hard that I'd have to work twice times as hard to put out the same numbers as LolAFKHunter_32847, and bring less group utility while doing it. I kept hoping the numbers would go back up enough to justify swapping back, but honestly, I would have been reluctant to change back even if they had, solely because I would have had to pick between better numbers and using the pet I wanted. This was not a small consideration, as almost all of my interest in my hunter at the start of Wrath was to level high enough to tame the Hive Queen in Sholazar. Once I got her, I was in heaven. Wherever I went, Hougouha came with me, or "that @#$% wasp" as she came to be known among the melee of my groups. Sure, I dabbled with a Devilsaur, and briefly ran around battlegrounds screaming with glee as my Chimaera sat on peoples' ankles like a faithful little Spamstringer, but for the most part if I wanted to do anything, I got out my beautiful, glorious, fantastic wasp and ran around using her to maul faces.

I suppose this is a very round-about way of explaining why I love Beast Mastery. I rolled my first hunter, way back in the day, because I was watching my brother play his hunter and he whipped out a (new to me) pet: a black scorpid with red spots, half as big as he was. I swore on the spot that I would make a hunter, tame that thing, and turn it onto the biggest, most fantastic chitinous killing machine Azeroth had ever seen. Shoot things? Well, sure, I guess this "hunter" or whatever could do that. Be a master of survival? I guess that's kind of cool. Have my choice of fantastic beasts at my beck and call? SIGN ME UP.

And then Exotics came along. Suddenly if I'm a Beast Master, yes, all my pets are at least a little better, but certain ones are REALLY better. That scorpid I made my hunter for? Nope, not good enough. The wasp I all but bought an expansion for? Nope, not good enough. My beautiful wind serpent, my adorable little ravager, my cranky raptor? Nope! If I want to show up to a "be good at putting out numbers" event as a Beast Master and not get laughed out of the group, I'm obligated to go pick up one of very few pet families. Which sounds an awful lot like vanilla (you had Brokentooth, or later any cat) or Burning Crusade (you had a cat, raptor, or ravager; later a wind serpent; later a scorpid). And I know a lot of people were thrilled that Brokentooth was awesome back in the day, but as someone who wanted, and wants, to be able to use the pet they like without shooting their numbers in the foot, the slow death of "there is only 1-3 good pet(s), and it it this!" is the sort of thing I send love letters to Blizzard for.

So, in short: I play Beast Mastery to make my pets awesome. I don't play it to determine what my pets are.

[TygerDarkstorm]

I play BM because it's the spec that I have always loved. It's the spec that shows the ultimate bond with your pet, regardless of whether it's exotic or not. I played BM in WotLK despite its lack in numbers to prove that the spec was still worth playing, pretty pets or not. I surprised quite a few people with the numbers I was able to pump with the spec.

With the introduction of 4.0.1, you can truly use whatever pet you want, no matter what your spec (obviously min-maxers will always find the "best" pet), and BM hunters who choose exotics get rewarded with a second ability. BM's all about the power of your pet and how you can manage the pet and your CDs, etc.

I'd be open to exotic pets being the BM level 10 spec pick thing (with the bonus exotic pet abilities being given to the exotic pets at a much later level) that way low level BMs have more access to the very cool pets that BM offers, or they can choose to use a "normal" pet. The awesome exotic pets that come with being BM feel like a reward for wanting to play a spec that most people consider "inferior".

[Kalliope]

As it stands currently, there really isn't much difference between the exotics and non-exotics anyway in terms of dps (ignoring chimeras and worms for AoE on the grounds that there will be fewer AoE pulls in Cataclysm, so neither pet will be required...in theory). That's without giving exotic abilities to regular pets.

Exotics are a reward for BM, not a requirement. I have my doubts that the exotic abilities, outside of the AoE or the "buffbot" abilities, are going to be gamebreaking.

[SpiritBinder]

Hahaha, this thread is fun, from reading it from beginning to end, even I was like No No No NO, oh..yeah, oh that too, I don't really think that, I LOVE that idea! Oh oh, and ....

They pounce like a hungry manbearpig.

I did'ed lol, a lot!

Lets all just sit back, relax, and have a glass of tequila.

Oh Oh, can I tame the worm at the bottom? Hang on.... does it have still have burrow or is a new MM/SV Worm <.<

Pengu: I've gotten better at not being offended but people are allowed to get offended when something offensive was said. I wasn't screaming at him. I was pointing out to him that his statement was very offensive to some, including me.

/agreed

me on the other hand, I have taken a "bite your tongue and keep the bad words in" vow of posting to try not embarrass myself needlessly anymore... well Tring any ways

And you heard it here 1st ladies and gentlemen.......

I have my doubts that the exotic abilities, outside of the AoE or the "buffbot" abilities, are going to be gamebreaking.

^ Quoted For Truth !!!!!

[Lisaara]

Aww....that means a lot coming from you Spirit. <3

[Daniya]

The entire point of BM is it about the pet and the ability to tame exotic pets.

I can't agree with this statement. Yes the entire point of BM is the pet. But NOT exotic pets. BM hunters were still pet centric, interesting and fun before wrath where exotics were introduced.

I find it really strange people want BM hunters to be the most limited in pet choice, by making exotics better.

[TygerDarkstorm]

The exotics aren't technically better than there normal counterparts now. They're even more of a reward for BM hunters now than they were before. Cats and spirit beasts do the same thing now, spirit beasts just get a heal ability, but no one's saying you HAVE to use the spirit beast. The heal does not necessarily make it better than a regular cat; that's a matter of opinion.

[Lisaara]

The exotics aren't technically better than there normal counterparts now. They're even more of a reward for BM hunters now than they were before. Cats and spirit beasts do the same thing now, spirit beasts just get a heal ability, but no one's saying you HAVE to use the spirit beast. The heal does not necessarily make it better than a regular cat; that's a matter of opinion.

Thats what I've been trying to say all along. Hehe.

[TygerDarkstorm]

The exotics aren't technically better than there normal counterparts now. They're even more of a reward for BM hunters now than they were before. Cats and spirit beasts do the same thing now, spirit beasts just get a heal ability, but no one's saying you HAVE to use the spirit beast. The heal does not necessarily make it better than a regular cat; that's a matter of opinion.

Thats what I've been trying to say all along. Hehe.

I've fully agreed with you this entire time too. =P
I felt it needed to be repeated since it feels like some of the others are reading something different than what we're saying.

[Lisaara]

The exotics aren't technically better than there normal counterparts now. They're even more of a reward for BM hunters now than they were before. Cats and spirit beasts do the same thing now, spirit beasts just get a heal ability, but no one's saying you HAVE to use the spirit beast. The heal does not necessarily make it better than a regular cat; that's a matter of opinion.

Thats what I've been trying to say all along. Hehe.

I've fully agreed with you this entire time too. =P
I felt it needed to be repeated since it feels like some of the others are reading something different than what we're saying.

I've noticed the trend. Kinda got tired of repeating myself after awhile. Plus RL called me to do things.

[TygerDarkstorm]

I've noticed the trend. Kinda got tired of repeating myself after awhile. Plus RL called me to do things.

Yeah, not sure how much more it needs to be repeated; if they don't get it, they don't get it. I guess all that matters is that we know what BM means to us.