What am I always doing wrong?... not a happy story...[Kinda]

[Rottingham]

WARNING! This is very long... and I will be replacing real life names with B, E and E2... the other person in this story... i'm too disgusted to even just give her a letter...

Ok, so hear it goes... back in August, a girl I was friends with back in junior year texted me out of the blue. I don't even know how she got my number. Anyway, we were talking and she was always complainign to me how guys were jerks to her and she wants to meet a guy that treats her right. I kept thinking that it was like she was telling me she liked me because she said she wanted guys to be more like me.

So a few months go by, it's october I think, and she comes home from college for the weekend and we hang out. I was planning on asking her out, but she brought her friend and her sister so it would have been weird. It was then that she was crying because her ex boyfriend was trying to get back together with her. keep in mind that this guy broke up with her twice, and one of those times it was because he was cheating on her with another girl. She told me, and swore to God that she would never get back with him. So I decide to ask her out, and she said she wasn't sure and she'd let me know. Sunday she tells me over text that I was 'too nice of a guy' for her to go out with because I wasnt an asshole that made fun of everyone but her, but she still wanted to be friends.

On Monday she told me she got back together with her ex... and she wuld talk about hjow he changed, but then cry because he was always picking on her and forgetting about her, and her friends stopped talking to her because they hated him adn how he treated her. And it made me feel like crap because this guy treats her this way and she didn't even give me a chance... but I kept talking to her to comfort her because If I didnt then nobody would and I never want to leave anyone in that position.

I was losing sleep over it... lots of sleep. and by January I wouldn't even go to sleep until around 4 because I'd be in bed thinking about it... I decided to tell her about it. we were supposed to hang out on Sunday, but she cancelled because she had to do something with her boyfriend. So I had to tell ehr over the phone. and as I'm telling her this, she laughs at me.

I stop contacting her, hoping that I could sleep, and for a while I could, but then I couldnt anymore. My friend from my acting class, E, helped me thorugh this. As me and E started to hang out more, the more I liked her. I was also plannign on asking her out since we've been friends for a few month now. so at the beginning of this month, I brought up the couage to finally ask her, but I wanted to do it when all our friends weren't around. literally seconds before everyone else left, she said "hey, what do you guys think of B? I think he likes me!"

That hit me like a truck... So I kind of did nothing. But later on when we were in the cafe at college, our friend E2 came by. we were talking and someone said something stupid and E2 said "Oh yeah! B's girlfriend did that last weekend!" So E was upset,a dn she was talking to me about it. but then the next week, she just stopped talking to me. I didn't act weird or anything like that in front of her, just acted like I normally do, and it seemed like she avoided me.

So me and E started talking again when i get a text from her when I get home on saturday. "B is single on facebook now! OMG I cannot be happier, Brain!" She calls me Brain, long story don't ask... But now she's talking nonstop about him again... I cant stand it anymore. i don't know what to do... I'm so confused and I don't understand why I'm never given a chance

Well I got that off my chest... It feels a bit better but not entirly... But what do you guys think i'm always doing wrong?

[Keleri]

Well, with the first girl, it's good that you're being a friend to her, but she is just a classic case of someone who has been in so many abusive relationships that she expects all relationships to be so, and thinks she deserves to be mistreated. It hurts but you will want to stay away from her-- unless she gets some counseling-- because she will either sabotage or break up a relationship with someone who is actually nice to her.

With your other friend, E, well unfortunately she just has a crush on someone else right now. You could wait a little while for her to get over it and try asking her out again. If she says no, then just say okay and continue on as normal.

Unfortunately when you're dating you'll get way more No than Yes, and getting rejected is just something that you'll have to steel yourself toward. Generally as long as you're nonchalant about it and not clingy, then you can keep being friends with that person even if they say no.

Finally (this is just in general, since I don't know anything about you except that you're a caring friend) you do have to make sure that you are in some way interesting to arouse the interest of other humans. Being nice isn't enough, although it is required.

[Felidire]

I think the first girl is just nuts, and generally clueless about guys.. (If a guy cheats on you like that, he's not going to change, in fact it's very rare that we ever change for someone else. Family, relatives, friends of my parents, guys that my friends used to date (friends were mostly female), and even myself -- I've tried to change for someone in a relationship but it doesn't work like that, what happens is we hold the change for a couple of weeks and then slowly revert back to how we were before. So yes, unfortunately that first girl sounds like she's in for a lifetime of sad, and running around in circles pursuing unsuccessful relationships. Nothing you can really do about it, but you can do a lot better.

Second girl sounds a little more reasonable.. But you haven't said anything yet?

What I tend to if I have a crush on someone is I just tell them upfront "Hey, you with the face, I like you. >:3" They'll either get creeped out, talk to you about it and ask why, or say "cool" and change the subject. In any event I wouldn't ask them out, i'd give them a couple days to think about it; if anyone is losing sleep now it's them, not you. If they want to date you then you don't need to worry because they'll randomly contact you to let you know that they like you back... If they don't contact you back? Well.. They never rejected you because you never asked them out, so no blow to your ego and you can keep looking without feeling down. Plus this isn't something that i've seen a lot of guys do, so chances are quite a few girls will be wondering why you said it, didn't ask them out, and it'll keep them curious (makes you look more interesting/mysterious.)

It's good being a nice person but don't always be the one chasing others, It's likely that you'll get dragged through the pits and back so just know when someone's worth the effort and when to look the other way. If your usual dating methods aren't going too well then maybe you should try this out. Just admit that you like her "...just wanted you to know." if she starts liking you in a couple of days, then cool! If she wants to be obsessive and keep chasing the other guy while ignoring you then big deal, you can find someone twice as good with half the amount of effort and stress, so her loss. Project confidence! =P

[Lisaara]

Well, with the first girl, it's good that you're being a friend to her, but she is just a classic case of someone who has been in so many abusive relationships that she expects all relationships to be so, and thinks she deserves to be mistreated. It hurts but you will want to stay away from her-- unless she gets some counseling-- because she will either sabotage or break up a relationship with someone who is actually nice to her.

With your other friend, E, well unfortunately she just has a crush on someone else right now. You could wait a little while for her to get over it and try asking her out again. If she says no, then just say okay and continue on as normal.

Unfortunately when you're dating you'll get way more No than Yes, and getting rejected is just something that you'll have to steel yourself toward. Generally as long as you're nonchalant about it and not clingy, then you can keep being friends with that person even if they say no.

Finally (this is just in general, since I don't know anything about you except that you're a caring friend) you do have to make sure that you are in some way interesting to arouse the interest of other humans. Being nice isn't enough, although it is required.

Imma have to agree with this. First girl is a total nutjob and you're better off by cutting out such a tumor.

2nd girl....well....maybe you should ask her out despite your friends are there. I'm noticing this pattern you always keep waiting. Next time you wanna ask them out....do it. Verbally or by note...or something.

[Rottingham]

Thanks guys... But long story short she did end up getting together with B...

I think that you guys are right, it is mostly my fault. I do tend to wait a little too long. It just felt good getting this off my chest though... I try to tell friends but since they co to different colleges it's hard to talk to them. plus they're always busy with work and such.

Thaks guys for listening

[Heleos]

She's using you as a crutch. Many girls out there, esp in college. You'll be fine.

You're in your junior year, live life.

[Rottingham]

You're in your junior year, live life.

I'm actually a freshman in college not a junior in college lol. But anyway, My idea of living life is rathert dull. I don't drink, do drugs, and I'm absinant. So yeah, I'm a pretty boring person.

[Samskeyti]

But anyway, My idea of living life is rathert dull. I don't drink, do drugs, and I'm absinant. So yeah, I'm a pretty boring person.

Please don't think that smoking, drinking and taking drugs makes someone an interesting person!
You are interesting because you are being yourself, not because you try to fit in with others. And I don't think any person is boring, there's always something about people, you just have to find it.

Don't feel disheartened because of what happened, sometimes the person that's meant for you comes around in the most unexpected ways. The key is not to search and try, just be yourself, don't try to impress anyone, and see what life brings you.

[Worba]

You're in your junior year, live life.

I'm actually a freshman in college not a junior in college lol. But anyway, My idea of living life is rathert dull. I don't drink, do drugs, and I'm absinant. So yeah, I'm a pretty boring person.

Not drinking / not doing drugs doesn't make you dull - you've got it somewhat backwards there. In college, people drink and do drugs because they want to socialize but are too nervous to do it without being blasted, e.g. they make themselves able to find stupid things hilarious and not be afraid of making fools of themselves, which gives makes it easier to hang out.

People who do that, do it because they need that social connection - stupid as it can tend to be. You on the other hand seem to prefer a more intelligent level of interaction. This is why the first girl probably prefers other guys when she wants to party, but came to you to unload all of the thoughts that her fast moving BF didn't want to listen to.

Not sure about the second one - all the E/E2/B/etc stuff was starting to sound a bit like "Who's On First", to me by then - but she sounds somewhat similar to the first girl, e.g. if you did hook up, what exactly would you do? If they want dumbed down fun, and you don't, then you're looking in the wrong place.

That all being said, college is a little early for anyone to be expecting scary-intelligent companionship, so don't knock dumbed down fun too much...

I guess what I'm saying is, girls don't seem to be doing you any good right now, so I'd recommend you write those two off and focus on something else - classes, if you've got nothing else going on, just focus on something you can apply yourself to and that feels productive and you may be surprised at how relaxed you will feel.

Later on, if you see a new girl you like, don't waste a lot of time trying to be her friend - if you want to go out with her, just ask her something simple like "Hey do you want to study for class X?" or "want to get a bite at the student union", etc. Don't try to be witty about it or use pickup lines - girls know exactly what's on your mind and usually will appreciate you coming out and saying it (politely) more than playing endless games or waiting around hoping... and if she says "no", just smile, say "ok no problem, see you later", and go on your way.

Above all stop waiting around - that is just a waste of your time.

[Rottingham]

As I was about to log in to type int his thread, E sits next to me in the college computer lab and wanted to talk about B and listen to her iPod... So I was afraid to open this...

But i really don't consider myself a bore because of my not drinking and my absinence... I just know other people do. I've only been invited to 1 college party before, and that was my best friend. When we played beer pong I had a glass of chocolate milk

But anywho, I just feel that Nice guys seem to finish last. I dont have a bad personality, I stick up for people, i'm very helpful, yet bad things happen to me. Whereas this guy who's a complete... well i don't swear either but he's a jerk... He gets everything. Is it that the world is forming to make the Nice guys outcasts and the BA's the glorified ones?

I at least uderstadn what you guys are saying! and I'm loving it!

I know I shouldn't 'search' for a girl, but it's really hard not to think about a certain girl when she does something to charm you.

And I know i should be up front with them, however Ive had bad experiences with that in the past. It's all just confusing to me, and I really wish i knew how to understand it better.

EDIT: by the way, B isnt the guy I was talking about as the 'jerk'. he's not a 'bad guy', just not really a 'good' one.

[Mozag]

But anywho, I just feel that Nice guys seem to finish last.

My dear Rottingham, this may very well be true, and usually is. You nice guys do finish last, but you also happen to be the ones the women turn to as soon as they realise that the badboys are a waste of time. The bad boys end up in jail or mental institutions, whereas you lovely, caring, nice guys tend to end up in loving relationships with the women of your dreams! It may take longer, but I suppose good things are worth waiting for, eh?

Just as a lot of guys, when they are young, tend to think with their nether regions and want to date trophy girlfriends who might be as stupid as baskets, so do a lot of women go through a "Ooh, mean boys who treat me bad are exciting"-phase. Not everyone, but many.

Just hang in there, enjoy your life, and remember that being single is fun as well! Eventually that right girl who deserves you will saunter along, and all these old relationship issues will feel silly and petty.

[Rottingham]

Thanks Mozag I am hoping that's the case.

[Corpsebryde]

Don't ever feel like you have to lower yourself to drugs/drinking/random sex to be accepted. You're amazing because you don't need those things to go through life. Hang in there, your special person will find you when you least expect it. It happened to me finally when I was 23. All through college I was constantly treated like crap and used by men. Then I end up working at a plastic factory and meet my current fiance who was the supervisor there. I never thought I'd ever find someone who loved me for me (I too refuse to drink/do drugs/sleep around), but it happened It WILL happen for you too

[Kalliope]

The older you get, the more people like yourself you'll meet. They are the ones who aren't blinded by the trappings of societal pressure. They stuck to their guns and either don't partake in such things or left them behind. Options only open up. In the meantime, don't worry about the present.

[Worba]

As I was about to log in to type int his thread, E sits next to me in the college computer lab and wanted to talk about B and listen to her iPod... So I was afraid to open this...

Kick her tail to the curb man... gently of course.

But i really don't consider myself a bore because of my not drinking and my absinence... I just know other people do.

Not boring - you make them nervous, because you refuse to dumb it down by drinking, doping and otherwise trying to "act cool", and thus they feel self conscious when you're around.

I've only been invited to 1 college party before, and that was my best friend. When we played beer pong I had a glass of chocolate milk

Good for you - seriously. Don't do it if you aren't feeling it.

But anywho, I just feel that Nice guys seem to finish last. I dont have a bad personality, I stick up for people, i'm very helpful, yet bad things happen to me. Whereas this guy who's a complete... well i don't swear either but he's a jerk... He gets everything. Is it that the world is forming to make the Nice guys outcasts and the BA's the glorified ones?

It's not that complicated - your "Mister B" (or whoever it is) goes out and takes what he wants, whilst you sort of... wait for it to fall into your lap. Which is not to say you should try to be more like him - like I said if you don't feel it don't do it. But don't wait around for girls to "come around" either, or set yourself up to be the shoulder girls like to come and cry on when their guy is treating them bad - that almost never works and when it does... it's often better if it didn't.

College doesn't have to be all about drugs and sex - focus on a career-relevant major (avoid "core classes" whenever and wherever possible) and use it as a good kickoff for the rest of your life, and it will be that much easier to meet women (and build a life) after college. You don't want to be wasting that opportunity because you couldn't sleep for wondering if E or E2 or XYZ is going to text you... you know?

[Felidire]

But anywho, I just feel that Nice guys seem to finish last. I dont have a bad personality, I stick up for people, i'm very helpful, yet bad things happen to me. Whereas this guy who's a complete... well i don't swear either but he's a jerk... He gets everything. Is it that the world is forming to make the Nice guys outcasts and the BA's the glorified ones?

It kind of bothers me when I hear people saying this kind of thing. I mean nice people don't finish last because they're "nice," we finish last because a sizeable portion of us tend to be extremely withdrawn and shy - thus we don't have the balls to make moves and take certain steps in life - we're held back by our own flaws, and because of our self-inhibition we never work towards resolving that problem. (I'm a nice/withdrawn guy trying to break out of this, but i've realized that the more opportunistic you become, the more people will perceive you as a jerk.) I think the goal is to find balance between being nice to the right people, and a jerk to the ones who don't deserve your kindness. :3

With the stupid habits... I drink alcohol reuglarly, mostly alone because that's lifestyle choice that i've made. There's nothing wrong with embracing those habits, the actual problem stems from other people take up things like drinking/smoking/drugs in order to fit in, it gets to the stage where it's almost expected of you.. If you make these decisions based on what you think of yourself and not what others think of you, then you're making the right decision. Who gives a f*ck what other people think? (and being smart in this sense makes you a far more interesting person than the rest.)

[ You nice guys do finish last, but you also happen to be the ones the women turn to as soon as they realise that the badboys are a waste of time. The bad boys end up in jail or mental institutions, whereas you lovely, caring, nice guys tend to end up in loving relationships with the women of your dreams!

From what i've seen, a lot of the women have fun with the badboys from 16-28, and then they come flocking over to the nice guys in their 30's (who I guess either don't know any better or are desperate) so that we can take care of their young children for them. XD; honestly, some people just never grow up..

The older you get, the more people like yourself you'll meet. They are the ones who aren't blinded by the trappings of societal pressure. They stuck to their guns and either don't partake in such things or left them behind. Options only open up. In the meantime, don't worry about the present.

I like your advice ~

We tend to have a very strict outlines on exactly who and what we want from a relationship, and the longer we wait, the harder it seemingly becomes to find the right person; when in reality it's not getting any harder, there's just far less people to choose from because time has chipped away the poor selections for us.

[Cialbi]

But anywho, I just feel that Nice guys seem to finish last.

Err, in what race? If you're talking about the number of girls you make out with, then of course that's true. It's also not a very important race to win.

If you want a meaningful relationship with someone, but she winds up in the arms of some party boy, then there never was a meaningful relationship to be had at the time anyways since she obviously isn't interested in that. If she does want a meaningful relationship, then she'll dump party boy fast and be available again.

[Rarako]

Aw, I don't think there is really much I can say that would be any better than the advice everyone has already put out. I can empathizes with you as far as your relationships go, though.

Throughout most of my time in high school I felt ignored and lacking, always a friend, and advise giver, never anything more. I was quiet and friendly to everyone but shy and reserved to a fault. When the chance at a relationship came up I would do everything I could to make it work and stay in them long after I had stopped being happy. I never drank (still don't), did drugs (still don't), and refused to be physical just to be physical. It was only after I was out of school and started to come into my own that I started to attract the opposite gender. Why? Because I stopped worrying about what others thought of me. I stopped trying to play the part of who I thought folks wanted me to be and just did my own thing. I only found out later after seeing guys from my old school again that I had had quite a few admirers, but they had felt intimidated by my skittishness and lack of self confidence. They didn't want to scare me off or risk being rejected so they never made a move.

So my advice? Don't hold yourself to others standards, be you. It might not seem like it now but you, how you are, how you act, what you think, are your best attributes. Believe it or not nice, caring guys can be more intimidating than anything else to a girl. They can feel untouchable and make girls feel paranoid about doing something that could cause that really nice guy and good friend to leave them for good, so they never try to get past the friend marker. I can attest to that last part, my boyfriend and I had a very rocky start because I was so worried that if we did start dating seriously something would happen and I might lose him forever. It took one very bad incident with another guy to make me realize that I really cared about him. Somewhere among it all I had fallen for this sweet, kind, nerdy, and all around great guy. I was willing to risk having the possibility of losing him to not keep him at arms length anymore. That's the bread and butter of it, girls know what to expect form bad guys (as much as they might not act like it), but with a good guy it can through them for a loop (if something goes wrong it might be their fault ) and so they stay with the baddies until they feel like they can be with a good guy. Stupid I know but chicks can be morons too. Just don't let it eat at you and role with the waves as they come. If you like a chick, just let her know. If she turns you down, well her loss. If she takes you up on the offer, well there you go! Casually offering to hang out with a girl can feel a lot less intimidating than asking they if they would like to date, so try that instead of a more direct approach. So I don't thinks there's to anything more to say than much luck and happy hunting.

[Saturo]

But anywho, I just feel that Nice guys seem to finish last. I dont have a bad personality, I stick up for people, i'm very helpful, yet bad things happen to me.

Not all girls are into the bad guys, either. For most it's just a phase, and for some (like me) it never happens at all. For example, my BF is kind and caring, always looking after me, and that's what I love about him. He's awesome, because he's himself and he cares about me. Just be yourself, and someone will come along, because either the girls into the bad guys will realize that it's a bad idea and find that you're awesome, or someone who simply likes smart, nice boys instead of the "cool", drinking ones will come along. Just be yourself, and don't give up. Giving up means that you fail. :)

[Celi]

From personal experience I've found that some guys can also start out seeming nice and soon enough turn out not to be. Makes one wary about the nice guy when encountering him. Is he really a nice guy or is it just an act.

Not saying you're like that of course! But there are guys out there giving nice guys a bad name.

As for the two young ladies in question. First is a nutjob. Distancing yourself from her would be a very good move. As for the second. That's a hard one and depends on how willing you are to take a chance. If I was a guy, I'd ask her if she wanted to join me for a coffee (or something, not a date) and lay it out: "Look, I know you like XYZ but I really like you as well." That way the two of you could discuss if you are comfortable remaining friends. It also means that if things don't work out with her and the other guy, she might remember that you're there and you could find yourself in the running.