Rework BM and exotic beast status

[Wain]

I don't think it's likely we'll ever get things that aren't classed as beasts, even if they're beastly in nature. I think they'd be too worried about eroding the edges of what's allowed.

From the game I get the impression that the average cloud serpent or proto-drake is no more sentient than a gorilla, probably less, but I think it'd be pushing it too much for Blizzard to agree to that. Just because they are dragon-like, even if they're not dragons.

Also, this thread has some great ideas and proposing other creatures as possible tames for BMs is perfectly understandable. But please don't let's get bogged down in arguing over what should be tameable. Because we've had other threads on that and it's always ended up somewhat with nerves frayed and a complete impasse. I don't want to see this thread end up like that at the expense of a lot of other ideas

[Lisaara]

Moving away from what should and shouldn't be tameable, since this isn't really the topic for it, I'd prefer BM keep their exotic tames since that's the main reason I play BM. Beasts that are exotic, from a lore standpoint, are much harder to tame and no ordinary hunter could do it. You have to have a special affinity towards beasts for it. But I'd love for us to have more, like 2 pets instead of one out and rather than us doing much firing(we can do a little), we micromanage our pets to do things rather than it being automatic.

[Kalhoun]

I'm of the mind set of "if NPCs can tame it, Beast Masters should be able to as well." I thought it was great that we could eventually learn to tame Direhorns by finding a book of dinomancy. It would be neat if BM hunters, at some level, could do a quest chain that in the end taught us to tame the various more beast-like dragons.

[SpiritBinder]

But I'd love for us to have more, like 2 pets instead of one out and rather than us doing much firing(we can do a little), we micromanage our pets to do things rather than it being automatic.

What if as BM we lost the use of our bows completely as BM, instead we use Agi based weapons for stats (Polearms/Swords/etc), and then instead of us shooting our bows for (xyz) damage and our pet doing the other (xyz) damage, we'd use use Pet 1 to do (xyz) damage (which could even scale with our weapon damage) and Pet 2 doing the other (xyz) damage (as it currently is)?
We would still have the maneuverability of what we have now, we would stand at range, we'd still essentially function the same. But would have 2 separate pets at our control, doing different things instead of a bow and a pet? Now THAT would be very BM, and could be all sorts of interesting, oh the possibilities!

[Danielfboone]

blizz should give back the training,lvling and feeding for hunters, they arent the same as what vanilla used to be..
and yes i agree.. they dont fee exotic anymore..

I have said before that I miss the loyalty part. I do NOT miss, however, the leveling stuff. When I tame something I don't want to go around mindlessly killing stuff to level it up. The loyalty could be reworked so that once you did have the beast's full trust, you didn't need to do anything any more. The Exotics are still okay to me but maybe they could be a little more distinctive from a normal pet and maybe not be so many of them.

[Lisaara]

But I'd love for us to have more, like 2 pets instead of one out and rather than us doing much firing(we can do a little), we micromanage our pets to do things rather than it being automatic.

What if as BM we lost the use of our bows completely as BM, instead we use Agi based weapons for stats (Polearms/Swords/etc), and then instead of us shooting our bows for (xyz) damage and our pet doing the other (xyz) damage, we'd use use Pet 1 to do (xyz) damage (which could even scale with our weapon damage) and Pet 2 doing the other (xyz) damage (as it currently is)?
We would still have the maneuverability of what we have now, we would stand at range, we'd still essentially function the same. But would have 2 separate pets at our control, doing different things instead of a bow and a pet? Now THAT would be very BM, and could be all sorts of interesting, oh the possibilities!

You mean like Rexxar? I'd kill for that so bad. <3 I waaaaant this as a thing.

[erictks1]

I was bring my dogs for an evening walk yesterday this idea just Pop out from my mind, if I can handle 5 dogs at a time for an evening walk , why not a beast master handle 5 pets at a time for battle

[SpiritBinder]

You mean like Rexxar? I'd kill for that so bad. <3 I waaaaant this as a thing.

Kind of like Rexxar, but with no melee.
You wouldn't physically hack/chop/shoot at things yourself, but instead you'd be duel wielding pets, like the pets are your weapons. But yes, you'd be able to carry melee weapons for stats and protection (deterrence and the likes), but nothing offensive.
Anyways, one can dream

[Bowno]

I was bring my dogs for an evening walk yesterday this idea just Pop out from my mind, if I can handle 5 dogs at a time for an evening walk , why not a beast master handle 5 pets at a time for battle

Because that would be terrible for PVP.
Could you imagine arenas? They'd have to ban BM from arenas and BGs. Stampede is as close as we're going to get to that without having to worry about being locked out of stuff.

And of course, PVE wouldn't be very fair either. Hunter could just roll in with their perma 5 pets and solo all the things when its current content. Unless the pets do about as much damage as a level 20's auto attack at max level each.

I understand that it sounds fun at first, but when you really think about mechanics, it wouldn't work out well at all.

[Lisaara]

You mean like Rexxar? I'd kill for that so bad. <3 I waaaaant this as a thing.

Kind of like Rexxar, but with no melee.
You wouldn't physically hack/chop/shoot at things yourself, but instead you'd be duel wielding pets, like the pets are your weapons. But yes, you'd be able to carry melee weapons for stats and protection (deterrence and the likes), but nothing offensive.
Anyways, one can dream

You're gonna laugh at me but I just imagined a hunter having a wolf in one hand and panther in another and is beating the hell out of Blackhand with them. XD Omg...I'm a terrible person!

[erictks1]

I was bring my dogs for an evening walk yesterday this idea just Pop out from my mind, if I can handle 5 dogs at a time for an evening walk , why not a beast master handle 5 pets at a time for battle

Because that would be terrible for PVP.
Could you imagine arenas? They'd have to ban BM from arenas and BGs. Stampede is as close as we're going to get to that without having to worry about being locked out of stuff.

And of course, PVE wouldn't be very fair either. Hunter could just roll in with their perma 5 pets and solo all the things when its current content. Unless the pets do about as much damage as a level 20's auto attack at max level each.

I understand that it sounds fun at first, but when you really think about mechanics, it wouldn't work out well at all.

This isn't that bad , I still remember Diablo 2 necromancer , solely use summon creature to fight for them in game , it works kinda well .

[Lisaara]

I was bring my dogs for an evening walk yesterday this idea just Pop out from my mind, if I can handle 5 dogs at a time for an evening walk , why not a beast master handle 5 pets at a time for battle

Because that would be terrible for PVP.
Could you imagine arenas? They'd have to ban BM from arenas and BGs. Stampede is as close as we're going to get to that without having to worry about being locked out of stuff.

And of course, PVE wouldn't be very fair either. Hunter could just roll in with their perma 5 pets and solo all the things when its current content. Unless the pets do about as much damage as a level 20's auto attack at max level each.

I understand that it sounds fun at first, but when you really think about mechanics, it wouldn't work out well at all.

This isn't that bad , I still remember Diablo 2 necromancer , solely use summon creature to fight for them in game , it works kinda well .

Except WoW =/= Diablo. Two totally different games.

Diablo is a dungeon crawler based around soloing and no competitve pvp to speak of. You have the option recently to work with other people, but it's not based around it. No pvp, no raids, no 5-man dungeons. Just solo content with the option of playing with others if you wish. Even achievements are soloable.

WoW is an MMORPG based around working and socializing with other people. You have to work with people eventually whether it's achievements, pet battles, 5-man dungeons, 10 - 25-man raids, etc. It also has competitive PVP via battlegrounds, arenas...heck it's even an e-sport these days. There's a crapton more balancing to keep in mind for both PvP and PvE since typically changes are not separate(unfortunately). What effects one will effect the other and it's a royal PITA.

So while I get the idea would be cool, it wouldn't work at all. What works in one doesn't mean it would work well in another especially when mechanics and environment are completely different. It's not as simple as 'hey this worked here, lets use it in a different game'. This is what developers have to consider heavily if they want their games to succeed. So all in all, 5 pets at a time would be way too much, but the suggestion Spirit and I were mentioning would probably work a lot better and balance a bit better since it's not over the top. However, I imagine it would still be a pain in the arse to implement.

[Danielfboone]

You mean like Rexxar? I'd kill for that so bad. <3 I waaaaant this as a thing.

Kind of like Rexxar, but with no melee.
You wouldn't physically hack/chop/shoot at things yourself, but instead you'd be duel wielding pets, like the pets are your weapons. But yes, you'd be able to carry melee weapons for stats and protection (deterrence and the likes), but nothing offensive.
Anyways, one can dream

I wouldn't like that at all. I would like my melee weapons back but in no way would I want to lose my ranged weapon.

[SpiritBinder]

You mean like Rexxar? I'd kill for that so bad. <3 I waaaaant this as a thing.

Kind of like Rexxar, but with no melee.
You wouldn't physically hack/chop/shoot at things yourself, but instead you'd be duel wielding pets, like the pets are your weapons. But yes, you'd be able to carry melee weapons for stats and protection (deterrence and the likes), but nothing offensive.
Anyways, one can dream

I wouldn't like that at all. I would like my melee weapons back but in no way would I want to lose my ranged weapon.

Was just thinking that, as other classes also have different weapons options for different specs. That said, we also have Rexxar too, whom goes to show that you don't necessarily have to use a Bow to be a hunter I was just putting it out there as a possible way to make BM feel "More Bestial" if the whole exotic thing was done away with.

If that's not something you'd like, that's cool, just throwing ideas around. It's kinda easy to just agree/disagree, but then what do think could/would make BM have a more bestial affinity?

[Tahlian]

How about a simple graphical adjustment...maybe the hunter takes on a bit of the aspect of whatever pet they have out at the time...sort of along the idea of the "shamanic mask" as seen in some religions. Note that I am not talking about WoW shamans here. Or to make things easier on the designers, say five different "masks"...wolf, bear, cat, bird and one of the reptiles/amphibians - maybe the turtle or the basilisk.

I don't think we need to go to full-on shapeshifting, because that's the purview of the druids, but just a little graphical flair might make all the difference in the world.

I'm not sure what ability to link the "mask"'s trigger to, so I'm certainly open to suggestions for that. I'd say Kill Command, as that's BM's sort of signature ability, but if you use KC, how long should the mask last? Till KC comes back off cooldown?

I don't know...it's just an idea to kick around.