Guild Leveling and Rewards - Blue Posts

[Kalliope]

The specific part of your post is that you think 3/5 is more appropriate for dungeon runs than 4/5, and that you compared it to the 6/10 required for the 10-man raids, correct?

It's 8 for a 10 man, so that's not what she was saying. :/

It's the same rough percentage.

[Ariamodasu]

Well there is the fact I got the same impression (Otherwise I wouldn't have felt the need to clarify my own stance) and a couple people I linked to. Text can be read differently than perhaps the intention is but I doubt there "Well life isn't fair so suck it!" being repeated over and over and over helped either. I mean all either of us did ask and a couple of others was to fiddle with the numbers a bit AND clarification particularly for guild alliances/if all quests count/splintering/guilds that shouldn't be considered a guild for being small supposedly, and we'll slowly inch our way up that way, quite unlike the freebie freebie freebie vibe I got from the responses back to them.

[Mindsprocket]

Ryai, you make it sound like this whole thread is one big flame war against you personally and I really don't see why. I'm pretty sure that most of what was said here wasn't even directed at you. For example, my first and fourth post in this thread had nothing to do with you, if that helps. The first one was just me being confused over AdamSavage's intro, and the fourth was general musing on rewards in games.

As for my posts that were directed at you, well, I disagreed with you. So, uhm, sorry? Honestly, I got your point. Maybe I didn't do a good job at adressing it, but just because I disagree doesn't mean I didn't read or get your posts. Everybody has a right to their opinion. I explained mine and it's different from yours. Deal with it. >>

[cowmuflage]

Hey i got lots of "stop telling me to leave my guild" and "you don't read my posts(when infact i did)" vibes from her posts when i did not read anyone saying so. SO it's not just the replys ya know? alot of her posts were not nice too :S

[Ariamodasu]

Hey i got lots of "stop telling me to leave my guild" and "you don't read my posts(when infact i did)" vibes from her posts when i did not read anyone saying so. SO it's not just the replys ya know? alot of her posts were not nice too :S

I wasn't going on specifically about hers, just that I was getting the same vibe from the thread lurching a bit into smaller guilds demanding things easy and the dark phoenix for doing nothing.

[cowmuflage]

Well your post seemed like it was :S

[Mockingbird]

I'd like a dark phoenix for doing nothing, TBH, it looks awesome

I doubt I'll ever see one under any of my characters, being in a small, casual guild that only ever raids as a minor portion of PuGs, but it sure is pretty.

[Ariamodasu]

Well your post seemed like it was :S

If that is the case I apologise, text narfing sucks in this regard and my own fault for not quoting the post it was regarding since it slipped onto page three.

[Golden]

I would also like to point out that they've just brought the Guild Achievements to the Beta, so they're pretty sure to go through big changes before the expansion goes live. In my opinion it's WAY too early to go into rage - if you don't like what they're planning, why not tell them about how you feel? Simply ragequitting won't do anything.

Personally I like to compare the Guild rewards to the state Frost Emblems are now: they're available to pretty much anyone who has an hour per day to spare for a single random heroic, but those who do raids actively will get their emblems MUCH faster. Same way the big guilds will progress a lot faster than smaller ones, but the smallest guilds won't be left with nothing - they just have to work that much harder to achieve those goals.

[Siliverin]

i really wouldnt touch this subject with a 50 foot pole for the simple fact everyone has their own opinions and its one of those subjects that makes people go at iy with each other for no reason. Yes if your in a big guild it will be easier and if your not it will be harder. Just because you need 10 people to create a guild doesnt mean those 10 people will be on all the time or even stay in the guild.

[Rhyela]

And if I in any way made it sound like a personal attack, Ryai, it wasn't intended. I was just trying to say that having the 4/5 for dungeons is just one aspect of the guild experience. Any guild with members can still get experience because they're also making it available via regular quests, dailies, achievements, etc. It will be easier for guilds who have more people, but not impossible for those who don't. I doubt anything will be wholly out of reach for those smallers guilds with only three people, even harder achievements can still be done with just a small handful of folks (if you want the Dark Phoenix).

All I was trying to say is that there are many, many options to get guild experience, and anyone who is in a guild should be able to reap the benefits in accordance with their time, experience, and dedication. It just may take more time than others.

So again, if I made it seem like a personal attack, I apologize.

[Kalliope]

Personally I like to compare the Guild rewards to the state Frost Emblems are now: they're available to pretty much anyone who has an hour per day to spare for a single random heroic, but those who do raids actively will get their emblems MUCH faster. Same way the big guilds will progress a lot faster than smaller ones, but the smallest guilds won't be left with nothing - they just have to work that much harder to achieve those goals.

This is a FANTASTIC point. QFT.

[karina]

Late poster but, OMG WHOOOOO! People maybe like 'WAAA QQ ITS WANTS ME TO DO THINGS!' But omg have you not seen the achivments they will be easy to get if you work together as a guild <3

[Kalliope]

Late poster but, OMG WHOOOOO! People maybe like 'WAAA QQ ITS WANTS ME TO DO THINGS!' But omg have you not seen the achivments they will be easy to get if you work together as a guild <3

Err, it's not that you're late in posting, but more that we just finished reestablishing that this isn't what's been said.

[Makoes]

I am very happy with the way the Guild system for rewards/rep will work. It makes it so all rewards are available to everyone, eventually. Guild rep being obtainable via dailies is nice, we dont have to rely sololy on guild runs/raids. A guild daily rep cap makes sure that people cant just keep "farming it". Helps to spread it out more. And smaller guilds can still have access to the reprewasrds as well.
I'd say that blizzard has done a nice job of making things available to everyone. Though, yes it is more obtainabl to larger guilds, most logically because it is the larger guilds that are the average size...ie guilds capable of doing 5-man, and 10-man content. and then the larger guild with the 25-man contents.
There are sooooo many "Bank" guilds out there, and I think that is another reason why blizzard has not focused more on the smaller guilds, ie >5-man capables.

[Palladiamorsdeus]

See, that's part of the thing though. They've already made it obtainable by everyone, so why make it that much harder for smaller guilds? They are already going to be way behind the big guys, you'd think it wouldn't kill them to give them another, and again slower, way of getting guild experience.

Buuttttt maybe that's just me.

[Kalliope]

See, that's part of the thing though. They've already made it obtainable by everyone, so why make it that much harder for smaller guilds? They are already going to be way behind the big guys, you'd think it wouldn't kill them to give them another, and again slower, way of getting guild experience.

Buuttttt maybe that's just me.

Blizzard also had to watch out for the massive guilds that were likely to be hurt by the new system in Cata. Sure, there are plenty of 25m guilds that work out really well, but there will be a good number of them that break up into smaller 10m guilds. This is already happening on my server and I'm sure it's happening or going to happen on others as well.

With drops now being the same between 10s and 25s, Blizzard HAD to give some sort of benefits in order to keep players sticking with bigger raids/guilds. It takes a lot of effort to hold the big ones together; this is probably why Blizzard decided to play more in their favor than the tiniest guilds. The tiny guilds are less likely to disband if the system doesn't favor them; they'll just chug along at a slower pace.

Just playing devil's advocate here.

[Makoes]

thats just the thing Palla, they are smaller guilds, so it will take them longer to accomplish things. Its the same in real life and in many aspects of games/life. The fewer the peole the harder its going to be, more people helping and working together, the easier it will be. If Blizzard favoured the small and made it easier for small groups to accomplish things at the same rate, then why would we want to be in a big guild if there was an easier way? This is an MMO, a Massive Multi-player Online game. MMO's are designed for people to interact with eachother...else why bother making it an MMO?

With this new system, Blizzard is also trying to limit or reduce the amount of Guild hoppers out there, by making it much more benificial to stay with a guild.

Also, many peope choose to be in a small guild for one reason or another. That is their choice to, and as such, they choose to chug along at a more sedated pace.

[Palladiamorsdeus]

It's not the sedated pace that bothers me, I think I already said that. It just bothers me that a smaller guild has to have at least four high level members all on at the same time running the same thing in order for it to garner any credit. Why not just have the number scale based on the number of guild members past one? So that the more of your guild are in the run, the more points you get? It just make's sense to me. What doesn't make sense to me is setting the number at higher then two.

[Makoes]

well, as said before, guilds are designed to have 10+ people, as shown in the fact that you need 9+yourself people to start a guild. Guilds aren't ment to be smaller then that, most who have guilds like that are either just starting out, bank guilds, or a small collection of friends, on top of that, the limits placed on how many guildies there must be is probably also there to deture mass amounts of people from making a bunch of small guilds just for reputation bonuses.
Small guilds will advance at a slower rate, medium guilds at a medium rate and large guilds at a larger rate. And really...if you're in a guild that can't even get 4/5 for a random...there's an "Invite to guild" button for that. The options are there to improve your guild, if you chose not to, then deal with it.
Guilds are designed to be a bunch of like minded, like goaled people who enjoy playing together, if your just in a guild cuz your family or friends are, then that is your choice and dont expect blizzard to caiter to that. They have designed these achivements, rewards and such for the average "serious" guild (10+ -200+ members), while still making it possible for the "little guys" to get there to. I'd say they've done a perfect job on this.

its like saying why cant we 2man a lv 80 raid cuz thats all that's in my guild? why cant raids scale to guild size...Help, I am not in a guild I cant raid...you know...Limits ARE needed to avoid high exploitation of the game.

True though that a 3/5 and 6/10 might be more desirable for guild run limits, however, I do understand why they are 4/5 and 8/10...if your doing Guild rep...bring your guildies.