Analysis of new Pet Abilities

[Sasrei]

The only thing is as a raider you may be required to have a certain pet out. Or have to tame certain families you dont like just to buff your raid. So yes wolves could get pretty... annoying sometimes but I did change it up with other pets at times. But now for the betterment of the group Ill have to tame pet families that I may not really like. I dont care for the core hound skins.. Kurken is not bad but the corehounds freak me out lol. So now if I wanna raid I just may have to tame every single.. buff pet for raids.. And have to use them.

Ny 25 stable slots may get full pretty fast.. and it may be just necessity pets not ones I love.

But some of the buffs do look pretty awesome. I guess ill have to read up on what pet Ill need if we are missing something. Our tanks hate the word "sunder" so I may end up using a raptor alot. lol.

[Epacsten]

Games are supposed to be fun, and these new pet abilities are not fun. That's the deal breaker for me.

IF I decide to play at all during this expansion, I will absolutely not be playing a hunter.

[Feath3r]

Let me put this in context. Unholy death knights got an ability that let's them buff their ghouls damage by 10% every time they use death coil. Keep in mind that there is an ability deep in Unholy that let's them do that for free from time to time. It stacks up to 50%. That means that death knights can literally put up and KEEP up a form of beastial wrath on their ghouls PERMANENTLY if they so wish. Except that at five stacks, they can transform their ghoul into a form of abomination that hits REALLY HARD, and changes all of it's old abilities to new, better ones.

Well, it kind of depends on how much damage the ghoul does to begin with, doesn't it? 10% of the DK? 20%?

The warlock and DK abilities sound awesome. But it's a lot easier for Blizzard to give ONE pet for each class those abilities. They have to give us 20-30 different abilities, and they specifically didn't want to have damage-dealing hunter pet abilities any more.

I've seen DK Ghouls kill geared clothies on their own. Make them stronger and I bet leather and mail wearers will be an easy target now as well.

The possibility of requiring Highest Damaging Spec/BM for raiding (two specs required for raiding... god) worries me. A lot. I hope they make BM the raiding spec so I can still have my pvp spec/raiding spec on my hunter

[Darknez]

Seem to have exotic, special and bonus abilities now.
There's also the newly discovered Beetle & Shale Spider family.

[Nakari]

Games are supposed to be fun, and these new pet abilities are not fun. That's the deal breaker for me.

IF I decide to play at all during this expansion, I will absolutely not be playing a hunter.

I have to ask, were the previous abilities much better in your opinion? How exactly was (for example) WotLK-Furious Howl more fun than Cata-Furious Howl? I can see where you are coming from in some cases, i.e. crocs losing Bad Attitude, but those were the exception among the pet abilities, and not really the rule.

[Palladiamorsdeus]

A transformed ghoul has over 2,000 DPS. It's claw doesn't hit for as much as a pet's claw, but everything else hits for much more. In an untransformed, zero stacks of death coil state the ghouls DPS is STILL beating out the BM pet's, and that's with worse gear. The only way that BM pets are keeping up with either the Felguard or the ghoul ((And right now I use keeping up lightly)) is because they modified the damage of the basic attacks to make them hit super hard. Regular attacks are weaker, and they have less attack options then either of the other two pet classes.

As I've said it's functional, but to me personally I am not entire sure it's fun. I mean yes, I like seeing bite/claw/smack go off and critical for huge numbers, but I'd sort of like to have other abilities to toss in there as well that don't involve just a buff or a debuff.

And actually for that matter, and I'll bring this up again, the Felguards Legionstrike is a singletarget OR AoE ability that ALSO applies mortal strike. Why couldn't our pets get similar abilities?

[Anansi]

The only thing is as a raider you may be required to have a certain pet out. Or have to tame certain families you dont like just to buff your raid. So yes wolves could get pretty... annoying sometimes but I did change it up with other pets at times. But now for the betterment of the group Ill have to tame pet families that I may not really like. I dont care for the core hound skins.. Kurken is not bad but the corehounds freak me out lol. So now if I wanna raid I just may have to tame every single.. buff pet for raids.. And have to use them.

Ny 25 stable slots may get full pretty fast.. and it may be just necessity pets not ones I love.

But some of the buffs do look pretty awesome. I guess ill have to read up on what pet Ill need if we are missing something. Our tanks hate the word "sunder" so I may end up using a raptor alot. lol.

25 slots should be more than enough to have the pets you want and the pets you need. I'm undecided if I'll run a BM off-spec to have a Corehound for it's Bloodlust if we don't have a Shaman, but I probably will.

Right now, as a raider, we pretty much are obligated to have a certain pet out, one pet, the one that boosts our DPS the most which is for most people a Wolf. I know people run with other pets and that's awesome, but whatever we choose, we have one pet for raiding. Personally, I love switching to my Wind Serpent for Kinetic Bombs. I don't have to, but I specced him for mobility and I love the excuse to swap pets for a fight. To me, Cataclysm will be even more of that which is awesome.

This also means that, in conjunction with CC, Hunters should feel more connected to their raids. Right now, our sole purpose is to do as much DPS as we possibly can. In Cataclysm, we'll be needed for traps and buffs which makes us more involved.

And as for your tanks hating the word Sunder, bad Warriors! Bad, bad Warriors! In my raid, our Rogue hates the words "Expose Armour" and is over the moon when we have a Warrior with Sunder, he ends up with all sorts of combo points to spend. But yes, the Raptor looks like a pretty baseline raiding pet for Marksmanship Hunters, and as a Troll, I'm more than ok with that. I've been hoping Raptors might be my best bet.

Games are supposed to be fun, and these new pet abilities are not fun. That's the deal breaker for me.

IF I decide to play at all during this expansion, I will absolutely not be playing a hunter.

I have to ask, were the previous abilities much better in your opinion? How exactly was (for example) WotLK-Furious Howl more fun than Cata-Furious Howl? I can see where you are coming from in some cases, i.e. crocs losing Bad Attitude, but those were the exception among the pet abilities, and not really the rule.

Yeah, I gotta say the new system looks *more* fun. I've been, and still very much am, on the fence over who I want to run as my main in Cataclysm, my Hunter or my Resto/Elemental Shaman. These pet changes speak well for my Hunter's chances, though the Shaman is still winning out by a small margin.

[Daranara]

Is it bad I'm also a little worried about community backlash about this? Not only from the other classes, but from other hunters, as well. There was someone on the beta forums last night just raging about how UNFAIR it was, giving exotic pets snazzy buffs. Claiming it was BC all over again; there was no reason to be not BM.

Granted, I know to take such overblown whining with a grain of salt, but I know that guy isn't the only one thinking this way. I just wonder about the hostility our new utility may be met with...

*end tinfoil-hat*

[Glassdragon]

Some changes do make me sad, buts other I am happy with. Over the years a lot has changed for better or worse but it always works out to be for the best in the end.
Our 25 man usually goes with 2-3 hunters so if these abilities make it to live then wolf, dragon hawk, and one of the "increase physical damage" pets would be great for all-around dps increase for everyone. This is assuming that you have one of every class and none of the pet buffs are needed from BM.
As for 10 mans, I like that we will have the flexibility to fill different niches. A class that can adapt to different situations is always more welcomed in groups.

I still see the wolf as being the most common pet for 25 mans, which is good news for my ghost wolf.

Overall, more options = good.

[Epicfail]

Yeah, I have to go with the ones who like more than hate these changes. ALthough I'll miss spirit strike and ferocious bite...

The biggest deal most people are making, outside pure dps bonuses, is that their favorite pet currently will have to be shelved in order to support the party or raid. We really are moving into a time of the game where the personal connection between hunter and pet are stretched further than they ever have before. Instead of finding the perfect pet for you and your playstyle, its about collecting pets like pokemon. Sure there are favorites and always will be, but with the expanded stable and new diversity of pets, we've hit a new milestone in making our little friends much more like a weapon or shield. I use swords because it does XYZ. I use Gondria because it does XYZ.

Personally, I like the changes because I don't have a strong personal connection to any one pet and want an excuse to use more types of pets. I like swapping them out per the fight at hand. I have wanted a "buff" pet for hunters ever since playing my lock. The pets should be sufficiently buffed damage wise to make the pet choice much more about the special (like wolves are now) rather than X pet does more damage than Y pet. I will most likely go through a list of pet abilities now before I pick my stable list before specifically "looks" are involved.

[Jangalian]

Yeah, I'm totally cool with all this, up until Cata drops. Then we'll see. Keep in mind that even then, we may be broken for like, a month. It usually happens to the pet classes the worst after xpacs and patches. Idk why, maybe because we're a sort of 'dual class', but there you have it.

Chillin' until Cataclysm, ftw.

[Kalliope]

I'm looking forward for an excuse to have my raiding spec be BM. Then I can truly bring a variety of pets to a raid. I wholeheartedly agree with Anansi's posts. And really, I don't get it. People complained bitterly about being forced to use wolves...more of our pets bring some sort of useful raid buff now, which justifies bringing them. It's still more options than we had before.

As for people complaining about exotic buffs being overpowered compared to regular pet buffs, that's a load of bull. Devilsaurs and wolves get the EXACT SAME BUFF. Just because corehounds happen to have a really really shiny buff, it doesn't make exotic buffs "better." For those worried about HAVING to raid with a corehound, someone already (wisely) pointed out that most raids DO usually have a mage or shaman already.

Sasrei, if your warrior tanks aren't sundering, they're really really bad tanks. :/ The only people entitled to complain about providing the armor debuff are DPS warriors and rogues.

[Turgus]

Personally I think this is just the start of the "Hunter Pet Pass" that Blizzard is doing, and I am quite happy with what has happened ~Thus Far~
To address the complexity of the issue they had to first make all pet DPS on the same level. (just how many pet families are there?)
Unfortunately for many pets, this means losing the ability that their family is known for. (Goodbye Bad Attitude, it was nice knowing you)
Then after "normalizing" the different pets they can give abilities out to the pet classes that can function as buffs/de-buffs.
(Wait! What?! Corehound Bloodlust!!?)

I don't think they have gotten to the pet talents yet, and I can imagine they will be getting a nice rework.
Maybe even a couple new abilities. So any Ferocity pet can get the ferocity pet ability, so wolves won't necessarily be better DPS than a tallstrider. Depending on the group composition, or if you are soloing, one MAY be better than the other. And that makes me happy.

Of course, that is my prediction.

What actually happens is still up in the air.
And, yes Blizzard does have a spotty at best history with Hunters.
But I hope for the best, and plan for the worst. (my hunter is not going anywhere.)

[Jangalian]

But I hope for the best, and plan for the worst. (my hunter is not going anywhere.)

This is the way of the hunter. We do not ragequit. We do not QQ. We gird our loins, and we survive.

[Fizzoogi]

I love the proposed changes.

Seems like they are giving similar abilites to all the pet types (cunning/tenacity/ferocity) for more flexibity. I especially like the raid buffs provided by beastmasters exotic pets. With some tweaking I can really see hunters (more specifically BM hunters) becoming viable again in the raiding environment for more than just raw dps.

Raptors look pretty impressive. The abilty to sunder armour on a ferocity pet will become handy in t hose 5 mans without a warrior. Crocolisks are looking interesting too for certain pvp situations (possibly arena), the ability to hamper an opponents movement much of the time on a pet which will be tougher to kill than a cunning/ferocity pet is a good combination IMO. Currently (with the exception of a crabs hold on a longish CD) there arent many options on this front.

As for nerfing solo play slightly. I don't care. Hunters will still be one of the top solo play class with these changes and I play WoW because it is a MMO. I have an xbox for my solo play games.

[Nymrohd]

I think there is a lot of exaggeration on how forced hunters will be to bring a specific pet. Buffs have been spread a lot and in a 25man raid there will likely be no buff missing. Perhaps in 10man raids a hunter pet might be able to fill in for a certain buff but most buffs are available across multiple families. So it's not like we got to catch them all, just 5-6 of them to cover the different buffs they can provide. The exotic pets BM only has access to provide: +Stamina which is available to all priests, Warriors and destro locks/Bloodlust which is available to all shaman and mages/+5% crit buff which is available to feral druids, fury warriors, subtlety rogues and probably some spec I don't remember. The first two will very likely be present already in a 10man since they are available by two entire classes. +5% Crit might be missing, but other pets can bring it as well. So nothing here tells me that a BM offspec will be required for serious raiders unless you are in a small but hardcore 10man guild that really lacks both shaman and mages or both warriors and priests. Sounds highly unlikely.
As for the abilities being boring I have to kind agree, they are autocast buffs/debuffs. Many pets lost their additional damage abilities but those were also utterly boring since you'd just let them on autocast anyway on most cases. The problem is simple. If ferocity pets have a wide variety of damaging skills then necessarily one of them will have an edge, however slight, over the others and it will be autopicked. Regrettably the most elegant solution for them to all be viable is to make them all do the same damage by doing damage in identical ways.

[Wassa]

Blizzard: We don't want all hunters to use the same pets. How can we do this? I know, lets get rid of all damage abilities and change them to buffs to fill in for missing classes for raids. Hunters will love that!
Hunters: But what about for 25 mans where we have every class and nothing to fill in for?
Blizzard: Shut up and just bring your wolf like before.

[Kalliope]

I agree with Nym, except for one point: these are NOT all autocast buffs or debuffs. If a hunter leaves their corehound's bloodlust on autocast, there is going to be massive raid emo. No, hunters will have to pay attention.

Wassa, wolves and devilsaurs will bring the exact same buff, so that's not going to happen. IMO, if all buffs/debuffs are covered, like in a 25, then the hunter will be able to bring whatever pet they want because it won't make a difference.

[Nymrohd]

Of course a bigger question is, will people run 25mans? Still no word about how they are going to make them special. More gear sounds nice but it will have to be much more gear (or legendaries in 25mans only I guess).

Anyway I am surprised to see one buff category missing. No +10% spellpower. Blizzard has a weird issue with that spell. First they made raiders use Demo locks for an entire xpac because of how OP their buff was, and now that they have normalized every other buff, they still only made this available to a couple of specs (With a rather weaker form available to a class). I think that +10% spellpower would have been an awesome buff for spirit beasts to offer that would also make some sense thematically; they are spirit beasts, they should be able to amplify spells around them, right?

[Teigan]

I'm looking forward for an excuse to have my raiding spec be BM. Then I can truly bring a variety of pets to a raid. I wholeheartedly agree with Anansi's posts. And really, I don't get it. People complained bitterly about being forced to use wolves...more of our pets bring some sort of useful raid buff now, which justifies bringing them. It's still more options than we had before.

After some consideration, I'm beginning to agree. Better a few "forced choices" than the One True Wolf of Leetness.