A Thought on Beetles

[Ryai]

Alright.

Then why should Beetles be exotic- and no please don't use the argument because of Cats and Spirit Beasts- because Cats and Spirit Beasts are about the same as a Wolf is to a Bear now. And Blizzard already made several creatures share the same ability and be in the same tree [Hawks/WS and Striders/Foxes] without either being exotic.


Because from where I'm standing, responding to not just your opinion Rawr, but everyone elses as an opinion always starts a discussion/argument, it always does for everything. It's why the adage of not discussing politics, sexual relations and sports came about. Because it'll always end in violence for those three. Verbally or litterally. But I digress. Anyways, from where I'm standing, I see no reason for Beetles to be Exotic, no reason for them to share Burrow with worms, no reason for them to be restricted to lv 69 Beast Mastery hunters. Nada.

I may also point at all the happy MM and SV hunters that are most likely gleeing in joy, over the fact they can tame beetles now too as I am sure I wasn't the only hunter to stare longingly at them; or wasps, or Devilsaurs or other now tameable or non tameable beasts.

[Rawr]

Fine then I shall reorganize my opinion to be a bit more clear. I feel that the dragonhawk/wind serpent, fox/tallstrider, and turtle/beetle same tree, same ability is lazy and needs to be fixed. I feel that they should either change a tree or (my example beetles) add a skill and label it exotic or lump them together into 1 family (preferably the one with more diet options). All Im saying..........not sure why having more options than just skin on pets is a bad thing but everyone has their own opinion

[Raydex-of-the-dawn]

Isn't the fox ranged and the strider not?

[Rawr]

Isn't the fox ranged and the strider not?

Just tabbed over, Petopia site says both are melee, I think the Tallstrider hit ability used to be ranged, not sure tho u would have to ask a PvPer.

[Bushsbuddy]

I also think that having two families in the same tree with the same ability is dumb, regardless of the minor resistance difference you mentioned.

Im gonna go back to what i said in this thread. http://forums.wow-petopia.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=6319

Basically, every pet should have a second, exotic ability that is unlocked by BM hunters. Whether exotics would then be tameable by MM/SV hunters doesn't really matter although i think they should.

This would allow even say, the Wind Serpent and Dragonhawk to be differentiated by thier second tier ability.

Now don't go saying, oh, we just can't think of that many more exotic abilities. You people are smart, so is Blizz, be creative. This would solve a lot of hunter issues I think.

[cowmuflage]

Well Rawr putting at the end of your posts still makes you come off as a uptight bitch aswell.

[Mania]

cowmuflage, that comment is inappropriate and disrespectful. Please remember the Forum Rules when you post.

[cowmuflage]

Did you see her post? it basicly was the same

[ZeroEdgeir]

Umm, not meaning to nit-pick, but if you exclude the minor variance in range/scope in some skills, you get a LOT of duplicated abilities.

Bats/Wasps - Stun (Bat is 1min CD/20yrd, Wasp is 45sec CD/Melee)
Bird of Prey/Scorpid - Disarm (Bird of Prey is weapon only, Scorpid is MH and Ranged)
Chimaera*/Crocolisk/Warp Stalker - Snare (Chimaera is 6sec/10sec CD/30yrd range, Crocolisk is 6sec/10sec CD/Melee, Warp Stalker is 6sec/15sec CD/25yrd range)
Dragonhawk/Wind Serpent - Magic Debuff (Same, cept for Fire vs Nature element)
Nether Ray/Gorilla/Moth - Interrupt (Nether Ray is 2sec/40sec CD/20yrd range, Gorilla is 2sec/30sec CD/Melee, Moth is 4sec/1min CD/25yrd range)
Ravager/Worm* - Physical Debuff (Ravager is 15sec CD/Melee, Worm is 10sec CD/30yrd range)
Serpent/Raptor - Armor Debuff (Serpent is 30yrd range/Nature, Raptor is Melee/Physical)
Silithid*/Spider/Crab/Dog - Roots (Silithid and Spider is 5sec/40sec CD/30yrd range, Crab is 4sec/40sec CD/Melee)
Spore Bat/Core Hound* - Casting Speed Debuff (Spore Bat is 9sec/12sec CD/6yrd range AoE, Core Hound is 10sec/8sec CD/30yrd range)
Carrion Bird/Bear - Damage Debuff (Exactly the same)
Cat/Spirit Beast* - Strength/Agility Buff AND Stealth (Exactly the same)
Devilsaur*/Wolf - Critical Strike Buff (Exactly the same)
Hyena/Boar/Rhino* - Bleed Debuff (Hyena and Boar are 15sec/10sec CD, Rhino is 30sec/15sec CD)
Tallstrider/Fox - Attack Speed Debuff (Tallstrider is 8sec/40sec CD, Fox is 30sec/25sec CD)
Turtle/Beetle - Tank Shield (Exactly the same)
Monkey - Blind (All by itself)
Shale Spider* - Kings Buff (However, is an Exotic without a second skill)

* = Exotic pets, so all carry an extra skill as well not listed, as they generally are very unique.

[Raydex-of-the-dawn]

Bats/Wasps - Stun (Bat is 1min CD/20yrd, Wasp is 45sec CD/Melee)
Different trees and ranges

Bird of Prey/Scorpid - Disarm (Bird of Prey is weapon only, Scorpid is MH and Ranged) Different trees, and the mentioned range

Chimaera*/Crocolisk/Warp Stalker - Snare (Chimaera is 6sec/10sec CD/30yrd range, Crocolisk is 6sec/10sec CD/Melee, Warp Stalker is 6sec/15sec CD/25yrd range) Crock is ranged, Stalker's not (still an issue in my mind), chimera's different tree and exotic.

Dragonhawk/Wind Serpent - Magic Debuff (Same, cept for Fire vs Nature element) SAME

Nether Ray/Gorilla/Moth - Interrupt (Nether Ray is 2sec/40sec CD/20yrd range, Gorilla is 2sec/30sec CD/Melee, Moth is 4sec/1min CD/25yrd range) Different trees, CDs, ranges, lengths, etc.

Ravager/Worm* - Physical Debuff (Ravager is 15sec CD/Melee, Worm is 10sec CD/30yrd range) One is exotic, different trees and ranges


Serpent/Raptor - Armor Debuff (Serpent is 30yrd range/Nature, Raptor is Melee/Physical) Different trees and ranges

Silithid*/Spider/Crab/Dog - Roots (Silithid and Spider is 5sec/40sec CD/30yrd range, Crab is 4sec/40sec CD/Melee) Spider, Crab, Dog-different trees Silithid-exotic (and 6 seconds I think)
Spore Bat/Core Hound* - Casting Speed Debuff (Spore Bat is 9sec/12sec CD/6yrd range AoE, Core Hound is 10sec/8sec CD/30yrd range) - Different ranges, one is AoE, one is exotic, different family

Carrion Bird/Bear - Damage Debuff (Exactly the same)
Different trees

Cat/Spirit Beast* - Strength/Agility Buff AND Stealth (Exactly the same)
SB is exotic, cat could still use a difference though

Devilsaur*/Wolf - Critical Strike Buff (Exactly the same)
Devil is exotic, see above

Hyena/Boar/Rhino* - Bleed Debuff (Hyena and Boar are 15sec/10sec CD, Rhino is 30sec/15sec CD)
Hyena/Boar are different trees, Rhino is exotic

Tallstrider/Fox - Attack Speed Debuff (Tallstrider is 8sec/40sec CD, Fox is 30sec/25sec CD)
I'm not sure what's up with these but I don't think it's finished as the Tallstrider is the OBVIOUS inferior

Turtle/Beetle - Tank Shield (Exactly the same)
Problem

Monkey - Blind (All by itself)/Shale Spider* - Kings Buff (However, is an Exotic without a second skill)
Not problems.

[wyndigo]

There's enough buff/debuff overlap in the actual player classes, I don't think it's too big of a deal that there's some overlap with pet-skills. The skins being different is enough of a difference to me for beetles to exist without limiting them to one spec only.

[ZeroEdgeir]

So what is the difference between the fact of it being same tree vs. different tree? Some abilities just won't WORK in different trees, and thereby, have to be in the same (Tank skill, etc.).

Oh, and Crocolisk is melee range. I checked the tooltips on every single skill when I wrote the post.

The point I was aiming to make, is that despite them being spread in 2-3 trees, or being exotic or not, that the only "unique" skills are for the Exotics second skill, and for now, the Monkey (may change with the Shale Spider getting it's other skill). I personally never looked at it as a matter of HOW the skill is used, vs the effect. But then again, I don't PvP, where range/scope may matter more, and personally see zero issue with more than 1 species, even in the same tree, sharing a skill, cause it's more about visual variety in that respect.

If they are in different trees, then it's scoping it between DPS and Survivability. In the same tree, it aesthetics (unless you factor in an Exotic). And aesthetics have always been just as important a facet to Hunters as function.

[Raydex-of-the-dawn]

Yeah, Crock is melee, Warpie is ranged. Tree differences are pretty huge.

[Gimlion]

*sigh* Haven't you all noticed? just about every non-exotic ability has a duplicate in another family. This is Blizzard proving to us that they care about pet choice. They don't want us to be forced into any one family b/c of ability, so I honestly think that this is making a large fight out of nothing but a kind gesture from Blizzard.

[Raydex-of-the-dawn]

*sigh* Haven't you all noticed? just about every non-exotic ability has a duplicate in another family. This is Blizzard proving to us that they care about pet choice. They don't want us to be forced into any one family b/c of ability, so I honestly think that this is making a large fight out of nothing but a kind gesture from Blizzard.

This was JUST ADRESSED a post or two ago, honestly! We're discussing total identicality, which is technically only seen twice, three times if you count Tallstrider and Fox (the former of which has a serious glitch). The rest are all either different ranges (Wap Stalker=ranged Crock) or different trees (Serpent is Cunning, wheras Raptor is Ferocity). These total identicals are:

Beetle/Turtle
Wind Serpent/Dragonhawk